Thread: Heroes For Gods?

Originally Posted by thebigspendur

yea but you see if its your way of thinking it's perfectly OK. Its the other guy or group who are the criminals and terrorists and all that.

This is exactly my point. Any time there is a group of people who have faith in a supreme being while proclaiming they are right and everyone whose faith is elsewhere and/or otherwise is wrong, is breeding and spreading a systemic virus of hatred.

People get way too fired up over these religious things. There are hard core Catholics in the Philipenes who have themselves nailed to crosses on Good Friday. People fast and whip themselves and grow beards and wear silly clothes and eat crappy food and don't eat lobsters and dance around with poisonous snakes and all sorts of odd behavior in the name of one god or another.

Originally Posted by icedog

I have heard there are people, large groups of people, celebrating the shootings at Ft. Hood as a great victory and hailing the alleged shooter, Major Nidal Malik Hasan as a hero. Simultaneously there are at least as many people who are calling for Hasan's head and are ready to imprison all Muslims (worldwide) as criminals or at least watch them as potential terrorists.

Now flash back to the end of this past May when George Tiller, M.D. was gunned down in cold blood while serving as an usher in a Sunday church service.The murder of Dr. Tiller was widely celebrated as a victory and Scott Roeder, the alleged killer was hailed as a hero by many, even as he boasted about plans for more impending murders.

Am I alone in seeing the similarities in these two horrible crimes? If the supreme being to whom you chose to dedicate your life and in whose name you are willing to end the lives of fellow human beings really does require the assistance of mentally unstable disciples, I will gladly remain an athiest avoiding carefully those who profess their religion is the right one.

And can we look even further here?

George Tiller himself ended many, many a life in utero, and was hailed as "providing a needed service" by many secularists, even as a "stalwart defender of women rights and beloved physician".

So, even the Godless support those who take other's lives. The secularists are not above this comparrison either.

Originally Posted by Seraphim

...So, even the Godless support those who take other's lives. The secularists are not above this comparrison either.

"Godless"? The murder took place in a church during a worship service. How are you qualified to make any judgemental decisions about the faith of someone you don't know? The fact is that Dr. Tiller worked within the boundaries of the law which says he did not anyone's life. According to the law, human life does not begin until birth.

Originally Posted by icedog

"Godless"? The murder took place in a church during a worship service. How are you qualified to make any judgemental decisions about the faith of someone you don't know? The fact is that Dr. Tiller worked within the boundaries of the law which says he did not anyone's life. According to the law, human life does not begin until birth.

Mr Tiller may or may not be Godless in his own mind, but I would strongly suspect that many of his ardent supporters are.

Other than that, you are pretty much making my point.

Nadal Hasan atttended a place of worship, George Tiller attended a place of worship, the guy who shot Tiller claimed to be Christian too.....

He may have been operating within the boundaries of the law. But I will refer back to my previous comment:

And without God, then people are free to make up their own minds about what is moral or not.

It is the law of the land, but perhaps does not conform to the 6th commandment. It is a secular law, is it not?

But, even the Isrealites at the base of Mt Sinai, as Moses was recieving the 10 commandments were breaking the very same commandments by worshiping idols, etc. The fact that they were breaking the rules does not make the rules wrong, it just means they were not following them.

Same goes for people who claim to act according to their misunderstandings of religious teachings.

Being in a church no more makes you a Christian than being in a garage makes you a car.

My recommended solution is to take all the gods out of it. As I wrote earlier, keep your spiritual relationships to yourself and the subject of your worship. If we can achieve that, then all people will have the same worth in everyone's eyes. Even in this discussion you write with a surprising tone of arrogance against those you have decided are "godless".

You wrote, "Mr Tiller may or may not be Godless in his own mind, but I would strongly suspect that many of his ardent supporters are." This statement makes me wonder if you are involved in the same discussion about the same topic. We are talking about two individuals who took a gun and the law into their own hands when they decided to shoot people in the name of the god they worship. When you say "Mr. Tiller", are you referring to George Tiller, M.D.? If so, please note that Dr. Tiller is dead. He was murdered and he would at this point in time have no thoughts at all about godlessness, brunch buffets, hybrid cars or anything at all. Additionally I don't understand your comment that Dr. Tiller has "many ardent supporters". The context of your statement tends to indicate Dr. Tiller is not a husband or father or husband or even a doctor but a bill that is to be voted on before it becomes a law or a team in some professional sport heading into the final tournament.

Originally Posted by icedog

My recommended solution is to take all the gods out of it. As I wrote earlier, keep your spiritual relationships to yourself and the subject of your worship. If we can achieve that, then all people will have the same worth in everyone's eyes. Even in this discussion you write with a surprising tone of arrogance against those you have decided are "godless".

You wrote, "Mr Tiller may or may not be Godless in his own mind, but I would strongly suspect that many of his ardent supporters are." This statement makes me wonder if you are involved in the same discussion about the same topic. We are talking about two individuals who took a gun and the law into their own hands when they decided to shoot people in the name of the god they worship. When you say "Mr. Tiller", are you referring to George Tiller, M.D.? If so, please note that Dr. Tiller is dead. He was murdered and he would at this point in time have no thoughts at all about godlessness, brunch buffets, hybrid cars or anything at all. Additionally I don't understand your comment that Dr. Tiller has "many ardent supporters". The context of your statement tends to indicate Dr. Tiller is not a husband or father or husband or even a doctor but a bill that is to be voted on before it becomes a law or a team in some professional sport heading into the final tournament.

Many people on this thread have expressed the opinion that God is a bunch of bunkum. Are they not then, by definition Godless? They are not that by my judgement, but rather, that is their own choice.



Nidal Hasan was also a doctor, and a son, etc, etc. A human being.