Thread: Respect vs. Blasphemy

Originally Posted by xman

Actually you said Karma was cause and effect and defined it as part of a cycle of death and rebirth and I said it isn't. I'm done with this circular argument now.

No you said the cycle of death and rebirth isn't cause and effect.

All I said was that Karma was cause and effect and that there was plenty
of evidence of cause and effect in the reality we see around us. This was
in response to you calling it a delusion.

Originally Posted by ENUF2

It is not just Atheism that dictates motive and direction but the make up of all that is us.

That is the question I asked and you haven't answered.

How does Atheism dictate ones motive and direction?

Originally Posted by ENUF2

Because of Him I'll go out of my way to help others in need, I will do the work of a missionary here at home or travel however far to fulfill a need.

You don't need a belief in Christ to help others. Or a belief in a god.
Empathy is all that's needed.

Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

Not trying to put words in MistressNomad's mouth and then quote her .... but.... When I was an atheist there was no debate because there was absolutely no issue. So when someone says that their unbelief doesn't equal a 'position' it is because they feel indifferent to the debate. At least that is my take based on my previous experience.

When I was a kid, raised by atheists, I once had a guy trying to convince me of the truth of the bible. He told me of the gospel, the good news, and I told him that I didn't believe it. He then told me that I didn't understand ... that the old testament prophecies proved the new testament and I replied that he did not understand .... that I didn't believe any of it .... so the prophecies proved absolutely nothing to me.

Years later I came to believe and then to disbelieve and now to be in a limbo of basically agnosticism in what I think is the true sense of the word. So for me there is a debate internally and externally. That wasn't true of me when I was younger, then it was the fore mentioned indifference, hence no position.

I agree with your assessment of her statements Jimmy. My deal is this: If there's no debate, I'm not talking to you about it because it's a waste of my time (except maybe in passing). I'm certainly not going to go around and around with you about it. It's just really surprising to me that this topic is so common on a straight razor website. For fun I googled something to the effect of: Religion vs Science Forum , and over 70 million hits came up. All I'm saying is that if I were interested in those discussions, that's where I'd go...

Originally Posted by richmondesi

I agree with your assessment of her statements Jimmy. My deal is this: If there's no debate, I'm not talking to you about it because it's a waste of my time (except maybe in passing). I'm certainly not going to go around and around with you about it. It's just really surprising to me that this topic is so common on a straight razor website. For fun I googled something to the effect of: Religion vs Science Forum , and over 70 million hits came up. All I'm saying is that if I were interested in those discussions, that's where I'd go...

I agree that there is little point in debating or arguing if you want to call it that. No one's mind will be changed but people like to vent and Mark likes to have some diversion so we get into these things.... at least that is my take.

Originally Posted by richmondesi

Reading this thread and others like it, it reads like a debate of Theism vs Atheism... Your posts included, but I think you knew that.

Painfully true. When asked and we rationalists explain our position it is repeatedly misunderstood by theists and 'round we go.

Originally Posted by ENUF2

A book on the Atheist's view of what to do with a Hoilday (this word means Holy day by the way) we do not believe in?

No. It is derived from those words. It has its own meaning now.
holiday |ˌhɒlɪdeɪ| |-di|
noun
a day of festivity or recreation when no work is done : December 25 is an official public holiday.

Originally Posted by ENUF2

I'll say this about us now- Our own numbers show that 20% of those who attend Church regulary do 80% of the work. That includes but not limited to Ministry and Missions.

What percentage of this profession are non-theists?

The rest of your post has either been answered by others or is 'holier than thou' non sequitur.

FYI BC Humanist Association - So What is a Humanist?

Originally Posted by xman

..... The rest of your post has either been answered by others or is 'holier than thou' non sequitur.

FYI BC Humanist Association - So What is a Humanist?

Romans 1:22 - `Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools' - The Holy Bible

Originally Posted by ControlFreak1

Romans 1:22 - `Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools' - The Holy Bible

I know nothing except the fact of my ignorance. ~ Socrates

I'm going to build my house out of a straw man -the first little pig

'Always look on the bright side of life'-Brian

Oh my! What have we here, a Theist vs. Atheist debate? Dare I join in? Hmm, well I have no self-discipline... so yes I guess so.

I was raised Christian, became an atheist, and I have returned to my Christian beliefs. Note how I say beliefs, because there is no value debating the existence of God. This would be a fool's errand at best.However, since this thread is about respect for religions and not does a god exist. I will state my position on this.

Religion is a philosophy. And everyone has a philosophy whether they call it that or not. Philosophy, being a group of stated principals, beliefs, logical and illogical conclusion, axioms and experiences have relevance to the holder of the philosophy. A person's philosophy therefore drives behaviors, decisions, emotions, responses, etc. So, in my view, atheism or any other ism is not a presence or absence of religion. If you have a philosophy, and everyone does, then you have a religion. Just not the same religion. I say this because most of my remaining atheist friends choose to debate me on the grounds of religion, when they themselves have one. An atheist says "separation of church and state". They do not want a Christian philosophy determining law. And yet, how would they not use an atheist philosophy to determine law?

Now, here is my answer to respecting religions. As others have stated on this thread, I have to see the resulting behaviors from the religion to know if I respect it. It is not my job to judge if somebody would be saved on the day of their death (my belief). It is my job to judge if I would follow them. If I would trust them. If I would do business with them. If I would vote for them. If I would let them watch or teach my children.

And there my friends is why I can say I respect some religions (philosophies) and why I don't others. NAMBLA is a philosophy, ergo a religion. I could hardly believe anyone respects that religion. I can name many religions that my religions says are wrong and that those religions say I'm wrong, but in the end our behaviors are the same. I can say the same in reverse as well.

Ok - that's it - back to work.