Thread: Big Government?

Originally Posted by Hawkeye5

Ahh, the Spender's tongue is firmly planted in cheek.

"Why just look at this country during the late 1800s when Govt was small and everyone lived happy lives no worries about crime, corruption,false advertising, shoddy dangerous products, good transportation systems and roads. A time when companies took good care of their workers and shared the wealth and gave their employees safe working conditions and good pay and benefits. A time when everyone was treated equally and fairly no matter where you lived with equal opportunity for all,a time when people cared about each other...."

I've been hoodwinked! Did I fall into your trap?? Damn! Well, it is my favorite soapbox.

Originally Posted by gssixgun

"The death of a Democracy will begin when the voters realize that they can vote themselves money from the general funds"

Don't know who said it first


edit:

Found it

This is what historian Alexander Tyler said about the fall of the Athenian Republic: “A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves money from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most money from the public treasury, with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy ….”

Just for informational purposes, America has fallen into a democracy. This country was founded as a republic and the founding fathers were smart enough to know that democracies had failed previous civilizations. Unfortunately, America has become a democracy and the result is that 51% of the people can maintain power over the remaining 49%.

I have never seen term limits as a sensible option. A fellow once told me that it takes ten years to really get to know a craft such as ironwork or tattooing. I have found that to be true in my experience.

I think the same can be said of being a public servant. Someone like the late Senator Robert Byrd or currently serving Orrin Hatch has a wealth of experience. Should they be forced out of office within an arbitrarily decided time frame ? If the politician is doing a good job according to his constituents I don't see forced removal as an intelligent policy. That is why we have elections.

Originally Posted by Qatsats

Respectfully, allow me to remind us about the good old days of the 1800's.

During the first 65 years of the century 4 million African Americans suffered under slavery. For more than 100 years after they were subject to Jim Crow laws. They lived under the threat of lynching the first 70 of those years.

I always take offense when people infer that America invented slavery. Slavery has been an institution for literally "thousands" of years. You fail to mention that during the 1800's, the institution of slavery ended, once and for all and our people fought a war where thousands died to make it happen. Slavery is the worst possible evil, but I am proud that our civilization is the one that ended this horrible practice.

Originally Posted by Fbones24

I always take offense when people infer that America invented slavery. Slavery has been an institution for literally "thousands" of years. You fail to mention that during the 1800's, the institution of slavery ended, once and for all and our people fought a war where thousands died to make it happen. Slavery is the worst possible evil, but I am proud that our civilization is the one that ended this horrible practice.

I don't see how he infered america invented slavery. He also mentioned it was only during the first 65 years of the century. Which implies it ended during the 1800s.

Don't forget our people also fought to keep it....they just lost. Which is a good thing. It's sad that there had to be such a loss of life to attain it.

Originally Posted by Qatsats

I've been hoodwinked! Did I fall into your trap?? Damn! Well, it is my favorite soapbox.

Not to worry, TBS is a true master.

Originally Posted by NYCshaver

Don't forget our people also fought to keep it....they just lost.

Excellent point......and thank god they lost.

Originally Posted by Kingfish

One reason our Government is growing out of control is the career politicians in the senate. The House of rep seem to be more in tune with the pulse of the nation and reflect what we want. We are not a true democracy, we never were, we have a republic.
The senate needs to have term limits and that would fix many of the out of control policies they keep adding on and never take away.
Government is a nasty, but needed expense and needs to get back to what it was made to do.
Strong defense, safety nets we can afford and get rid of the rest.

They keep dividing the electorate by color, sex, religion, and all of these other hyphenated categories. Divide and conquer, they have become the elite class while we fight over emotionally driven issues.

I don't know if you are aware, but up until 1913 Senators were appointed by the Governor of the state. Change your Governor and you changed your Senators. Under the Woodrow Wilson administration, the public were hoodwinked into thinking that all Americans wanted to vote for their Senators. The framers of the Constitution wanted them appointed so at least one group of Federal Representation would never fall prey to the popular people of the day.

When this happened, we became a true Democracy.

I would love to go back to the Senate being appointed by the governor's so we could get rid of them by changing our Governor.

Originally Posted by Alembic

I don't know if you are aware, but up until 1913 Senators were appointed by the Governor of the state. Change your Governor and you changed your Senators. Under the Woodrow Wilson administration, the public were hoodwinked into thinking that all Americans wanted to vote for their Senators. The framers of the Constitution wanted them appointed so at least one group of Federal Representation would never fall prey to the popular people of the day.

When this happened, we became a true Democracy.

I would love to go back to the Senate being appointed by the governor's so we could get rid of them by changing our Governor.

Not only that but the founding fathers never really trusted the populace to make the right decision in electing people so part of the equation would be in the hands of folks deemed better classed.

As far as term limits for all federal Employees that's bad. Maybe for elected officials but too many Govt jobs are very specialized and require years of experience to master.

Originally Posted by Fbones24

Just for informational purposes, America has fallen into a democracy. This country was founded as a republic and the founding fathers were smart enough to know that democracies had failed previous civilizations. Unfortunately, America has become a democracy and the result is that 51% of the people can maintain power over the remaining 49%.

Thank You....

Do you realize that most people don't even know that the US is supposed to be a Republic ?????