Now that's a question and another can of worms for a whole other thread or three.Quote:
Originally Posted by commiecat
Bob
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Now that's a question and another can of worms for a whole other thread or three.Quote:
Originally Posted by commiecat
Bob
The run up to the 2012 Presidential election has temporarily held off a worsening Worldwide Depression that will be devastating to all of us. A positive? Atleast till November.
Are you saying there is someone so powerful he can control the worlds economic system at his will?Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnus
Another reference to the Head of Marketing?Quote:
Originally Posted by thebigspendur
So anyone hear about Obama signing legislation making it a felony to protest the president/elected leaders? free speach anyone?? just saying...
Yes, I heard about this and there is almost no coverage and absolutely no protest of the First Amendment violation.Quote:
Originally Posted by alb1981
The First Amendment was put there to protect political speech above all other type of speech.
McCain Feingold was a clear violation also.
Crotalus, my friend, the writing is on the wall, it's re-education camp for us. His next piece of legislation will likely be the classic "I'm President for Life" manuever.Quote:
Originally Posted by Crotalus
He did no such thing. Just another manufactured controversy.Quote:
Originally Posted by alb1981
FactCheck.org : Obama Criminalize Free Speech?
factcheck.org leaves out the part that "willfully" was dropped from the language.
The law had bipartisan support - being authored by a republican in the house and a democrat in the senate. Both parties overwhelmingly voted for it.
Reading reports from sources slanted to both sides politically, it seems that the only people happy with the change to the law are the government. (how often do Fox news, Drudge, the Huffington post, and the ACLU all agree on anything?)
Whether it's a manufactured controversy or not remains to be seen - it does seem that there is more room now for federal law enforcement to abuse the law.
Any notion that one party or the other is responsible is ridiculous. Both parties worked together to make the change.
No it doesn't. The second bullet point under the heading Manufactured Controversy clearly states: "The new law revises the standard that prosecutors must meet to gain a conviction, from proving that a violation was committed “willfully and knowingly” to merely proving that it was committed “knowingly.”Quote:
Originally Posted by HNSB
In any event the point remains that the law in question had nothing to do with making it a felony to protest the president or elected leaders. Sometimes when something sounds too crazy to be true it is because it isn't.
Yeah. I skimmed it too quickly and missed that; I was expecting to see it somewhere more prominent.
When I went back now and read it again, it does address concerns about the loosening of the language and what that means - even addressing possible misuse by law enforcement agencies.
NOT while I still have a breath left in my body.Quote:
Originally Posted by 1OldGI
aaaand you just went on the watch list...
Thats fine with meQuote:
Originally Posted by HNSB
Isn't this what they do during protests. From HR347Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazarus
knowingly, and with intent to impede or disrupt the
orderly conduct of Government business or official functions,
engages in disorderly or disruptive conduct in, or within such
proximity to, any restricted building or grounds when, or so
that, such conduct, in fact, impedes or disrupts the orderly
conduct of Government business or official functions;
‘‘(3) knowingly, and with the intent to impede or disrupt
the orderly conduct of Government business or official functions,
obstructs or impedes ingress or egress to or from any restricted
building or grounds;
For those wishing to find conspiracy and put a noose around someones neck it takes very little substance to start the ball rolling. Once the ball starts to roll it just picks up more and more dirt until it has a life of it's own.
The change in the law is a minor technical issue and will have little effect except to have some folks use it for all it's worth. Knowingly is the important word there. Willfully is more degree. Practically you could claim someone duped you into violation and you just didn't realize. That's really the change.
Knowingly was pushing it, but I draw the line at willingly!Quote:
Where Do We Draw The Line?
Let's keep an eye on Space-X. We now have an opportunity to watch as the private sector takes over an industry that has been run, or subsidized, by the federal government for years. It will be interesting to observe whether the private sector creates more competition, jobs, efficiency, profit, tax revenues, and an acceleration in technology development. Yes the feds got us to the moon and back way back in the 60's, but since then? Now that private industry is taking over I suspect that things will move along a bit faster.
Nasa has done a bit more than that. Top 25 things NASA has done | National Aeronautics And Space Administration celebrates 50th anniversary | The Sun |News
Even if Space-X wins a contract to be an interstellar FedEx, it is still federal money though. Right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by honedright
We pay tax dollars for services. We assume that because our tax dollars are spent publicly that federal entities will somehow perform services to a higher degree or standard. But is that necessarily true? Why isn't it just as feasible that a private entity will perform those same services to the same standard, or even better?
Speaking of tax money and projects...
What happened to all the "shovel-ready" projects we paid for a few years ago?
I had the impression at the time that it would be WPA v2, but it doesn't seem to have happened...
Where did that money go?
Congress probably needed a raise.:)Quote:
Originally Posted by HNSB
As our type of government is set up it works best for the morale. once you kick out the standard for our consitution, then your government and the people go down hill. This can be traced back to our religous schools in the country, once they became apostate and turned against the Holy Bible (AVKJV1611) that showed up in the pulpits then in the congration then out in the streets then in the voting booth. That is why [B]Both( POLITICAL PARTIES ARE CORUPT!) That is why our country is going to hell they have no morale bearing!There is no spell check available at the library so excuse the spelling erors.
They got buriedQuote:
Originally Posted by HNSB
To quote our benevolent Leader, "Apparently they weren't as shovel ready as we thought." I'm glad he gets such a chuckle from other people's misery. My first guess is that at least a chunk of Stimulus I, II and III went right back into the Democrat coffers. The rest probably golden parachutes for our benevolent leader's cronies who are just far too priveleged to earn a living the old fashion way (i.e. an honest day's work).Quote:
Originally Posted by HNSB
Oh come on. the money is spent before it ever shows up. It has been that way for decades
I believe the Romans (upon whose republic ours was at least partially modeled) called that standard of ethics and morality "virtue." Nicolo Machiavelli believed, as well as our founders who by the way studied Machiavelli among others, that "virtue" instilled in the people via education, parenting and culture was a basic necessity for the operation and survival of a republic such as ours. There can be found many examples of the decline of that virtue in our society going all the way back to the founding. I'd say that the decline is exponentially increasing. Do you see any correlation between that decline and the weakening of the U.S. republic? And I am making the assumption that there has been a definite moral decline. But "virtue" goes beyond morals. I believe the Romans included in virtue those characteristics that are often associated with heroism.Quote:
Originally Posted by razorjoe
Yes, 'virtue' being essential for the governed, just as the lack of it has been essential for the governors.Quote:
Originally Posted by honedright
I say more religious schooling and less secular is what the world needs!
My favorite example of Roman "virtue" is that of the Roman Consul Cincinnatus who, once the Aequians were defeated, resigned his 6 month dictatorship after only 16 days, his job finished, returning to his farm and plow. If only those career governors and politicians of today could show such restraint instead of sucking off of the public for years while providing comparatively little in return.
Yes, the famous Cincinnatus, they wrote books and sang songs about him, and to this day little boys want to grow up to be just like him.
http://oll.libertyfund.org/?option=c...20&layout=html
I don't know about all of that....but we did name a city after him. And isn't it wonderful that we don't try and keep our citizens in poverty...well unless you consider all of the reckless entitlement/ bailout spending resulting in trillions of dollars of national debt that will likely bury our grandchildren. But I digress...Quote:
Originally Posted by gugi
Let's not allow an ad hominem attack at Cincinnatus to divert our attention away from one thing he did that was virtuous and honorable and to which all elected officials should aspire.
Is it? Don't we? I would think may be time to take a real hard look at the real reason behind all that downfall I keep hearing about...Quote:
Originally Posted by honedright
Ad hominem attack? I thought his name first came on the first pages of 'The Prince' the part with the dedication.Quote:
Originally Posted by honedright
Right on!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by honedright
Better yet, let's all get together and elect the meek and the poor, those who are running for high office for nothing less than the great honor of forfeiting their riches and power, tax shelters, offshore accounts....
I think you got your works of Machiavelli's mixed up. Cincinnatus is mentioned in "The Discourses" not "The Prince." Either, or, makes little difference to the virtue demonstrated by Cincinnatus.Quote:
Originally Posted by gugi
My point is that to wish for something is one thing, to be able to do it is another, and to actually do it is completely different.
Yes, to wish for something is called having a dream, to be able to do it requires training, strength, courage and virtue, to actually do it is why we honor heroes. Good point Gugi.Quote:
Originally Posted by gugi
Yes, like Cincinnatus :)
Obama was asked about those shovel ready jobs last year. He LAUGHED, and said I guess those jobs weren't as shovel ready as I thought.Quote:
Originally Posted by HNSB
I don't think we have a clear idea where all of it went.
A good part of it was wasted on loans to doomed "Green" jobs like Solyndra, Ener1, and Fisker.
WKRP in Cincinnatus.
Did Cincinnatus have a friend? What was his name again....? Biggus something....? One of is gweatest fwiends in Wome?
James.
There are many many things that are important and we use in our daily lives that came out of the space program. If a private outfit had been doing everything all those inventions would either have been salted away and kept secret of sold off to the highest bidder and all the products would cost multiples of what they do now. That's how private industry works.Quote:
Originally Posted by honedright