Thread: Never again!

Originally Posted by pixelfixed

The young radicals of today have zero understanding of what these symbols represent.
I see kids tattoed with this crap,people that do this stuff are ignorant neanderthals and should be taken out of the gene pool.
People caught doing this crap should be made to watch the films taken by the liberators of aushwitz and Dachow etc.
Young children in school today should learn about what the Nazis did,maybe it will instill some compassion and put a stop to this neo-nazi bullshit.

That is exactly what my father did during his teaching career.

Hard to cure ignorance and that is what bigotry and antisemitism is based on. If nothing else living inside the head that would stoop so low to do such a cowardly thing must be a terrible punishment.

Never Again Huh????

Really ???

I do believe that there are some serious gaps of historic information here guys..

Genocide Since 1945: Never Again? - SPIEGEL ONLINE

That is just the first link I found, there are many many more

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Never Again Huh????

Really ???

I do believe that there are some serious gaps of historic information here guys..

Genocide Since 1945: Never Again? - SPIEGEL ONLINE

That is just the first link I found, there are many many more

Glen:
I grew up listening to Survivor's stories, and the affected me deeply. When they would say "Never again!" they were referring to the attempted destruction of Jews specifically. I'm not quite clear as to the meaning of your post.

Glen is just pointing out that humanity as a whole has failed to adhere to the decree. Jew's were hardly the first to suffer such abuses either - one such event that is glaringly missing from the minds of most is the Armenian genocide (look it up). That points brings a good book to mind: 'The Great War for Civilisation: The Conquest of the Middle East' by Robert Fisk - fantastic read. BTW let me stress im not trying to belittle Jewish suffering at all before someone jumps me.

Originally Posted by EisenFaust

Unrelated point, but nationalism and socialism are gaining some serious ground throughout Europe at the moment as a result of the economic crisis and the increase in xenophobic policies and propaganda - I can't imagine we will experience any sort of militarised uprising as a result, but the trends sure are troubling...

I hope you understand that '1933-1945'-type national socialism is not a simple sum of nationalism and socialism.

On topic: Why anyone feels the need to portray acts of vandalism or disrespect towards houses of prayer is beyond me. From swastikas on synagogues to drunken youth pissing against the wall of a catholic chapel.

On a more cynical side note: Being Dutch I have heard the phrase "Never again!" too often in this context and noticed it is often uttered as a purely dogmatic reflex (I am speaking from my point of view and background and do not mean to trivialize the OP's father's experiences or post for that matter).

Let me elaborate. Looking back at history, I am skeptic about how hard people would really struggle against creeping and increasingly aggressive oppressive forces; Hitlers Third Reich didn't happen overnight and started out much, much milder than it ended (a slight understatement, I know), yet it took quite a while for nations and people involved to realise something even smelled fishy.

Things sneak up surprisingly easy on people, making them do things without second thought they never would have expected themselves to do, ever.

As referring to the intentional destruction of jews specifically, I don't feel there's much to fear. A small anti-semetic neo-nazi fraction in Jackson, Michigan is no real threat (abject: yes, destructive on a massive scale: no), and the situation in the Middle East is a different discussion altogether, which frankly I find most unsatisfying for all parties involved. And I doubt any nation will ever actually start a full-scale war with the state of Israël, such talk is more likely than not interior political rhetoric.

I haven't read any of the replies to your initial post. I think it's important to state that. It's a very interesting and important post. My father also fought in World War II, but on the German side. When I say 'fought' I mean 'served', he was an Adjutant, which I understand to essentially mean messenger or clerk. But he has interesting stories he doesn't like to share.

I am enraged by stories of violence against anyone; but most of all children. Violence directed at any race, at any time in history, by any perpetrator is obnoxious, vile and base.

Lack of love for one another and to one's environment and God, if one has one, and lack of love for love itself, I suspect, inspires such outward acts of hate as you've spoken of. And also fear. Fear of the unknown. Fear of uncertainty. A tribal protective attitude.

I like that you don't like it.

Pithor:
I appreciate the respectful tone of your post, and I agree with almost everything you wrote. The one point on which I disagree with you is "I doubt any nation will ever actually start a full-scale war with the state of Israël, such talk is more likely than not interior political rhetoric."
As a boy I was educated by Jesuits, who always referred to adherents of the Islamic faith as "Mohammadens," not Moslems (or Muslims). Fortunately, this was counter-balanced by my father, who was a professor of history and political science, and would correct their deficiencies in my education. However, they both shared one prediction: the PLO, Syria, Lebanon and/or Iraq would, if in possession of nuclear weapons, definitely deploy them against Israel. This satisfies von Clausewitz's definition of "total war."
In my original post I stated that I'm an atheist. Live and let live is how I choose to view matters of faith. This story, combined with observing/participating in my father's interviews of Survivors, and the ensuing friendships I fortunately developed with them makes me very sensitive to their perspective. Let cooler heads prevail!

Originally Posted by pixelfixed

...Young children in school today should learn about what the Nazis did,maybe it will instill some compassion and put a stop to this neo-nazi bullshit...

I really like the overall feel of your post, but I myself don't think education is the key here. In fact it can have the opposite effect.

I think some of us to a greater degree, and all of us to some degree like hate. I think we like anger and power and control and violence and even evil to some degree. What I'm saying is, that for some people, compassion is not something that will happen. I feel that's evidenced by the horrific evil acts that are perpetrated against masses. A violent act against any living thing is wrong; but genocide is just plain evil. I fail to understand how some of my fellow humans can be degraded to such a degree, yet at the same time I understand it completely. I don't want to understand it but I do.

Originally Posted by carlmaloschneider

I haven't read any of the replies to your initial post. I think it's important to state that. It's a very interesting and important post. My father also fought in World War II, but on the German side. When I say 'fought' I mean 'served', he was an Adjutant, which I understand to essentially mean messenger or clerk. But he has interesting stories he doesn't like to share.

I am enraged by stories of violence against anyone; but most of all children. Violence directed at any race, at any time in history, by any perpetrator is obnoxious, vile and base.

Lack of love for one another and to one's environment and God, if one has one, and lack of love for love itself, I suspect, inspires such outward acts of hate as you've spoken of. And also fear. Fear of the unknown. Fear of uncertainty. A tribal protective attitude.

I like that you don't like it.

carlmaloschneider:
Thank you. Peace out, bro'!