Thread: Chainmail

Originally Posted by HaiKarate

And this stuff will pull your hair out. Probabably why the Norman knights shaved their heads lol.

kind of like those old twisto-flex watch bands? (any one remember those?) Thanks for the useful information, absolutely fascinating. always wandered how it was made.

Originally Posted by rolodave

IIRC the warriors wore 2 or 3 inches of felt under the chain mail. This supposedly protected them from the points that got through the mail.

Is this correct?

DAve

There is no single answer to this as armour and its use evolved in many different ways in different parts of the world and at different times and in response to different threats. The padding under mail could indeed give some protection from points, but as has been pointed out, it also gave some protection from the force of impact. And don't forget we're not just talking swords/knives here, but spears, lances, bolts, and arrows as well. Not to mention the many other weapons that evolved and good old fashioned kicks, punches, and general whallops of battle.

To give an idea of the force that could be involved with, say, an English (well, Welsh, really, but I won't get into that again...) longbow, there is an account from one of the battles of the Hundred Years war in which an arrow with a bodkin point passed through the knight's leg, severing his femoral artery and killing him, before passing straight through his mount, killing it too. Against stabbing/slashing attacks, mail can be extremely effective. But against a heavier weapon or a longbow, I wouldn't take a chance. They simply transmit too much energy to their target. Just read any account of the battles of Crécy or Poitiers to see how mail vs longbow ended up.

Many modern reproduction longbows are 50-70lb draw. Those recovered from the Mary Rose are estimated to have had draw weights from 100-185(!)lb. The force imparted by an arrow tipped with a properly designed bodkin head would made short work of mail and at close range punch right through contemporary plate armour (assuming it was not angled to deflect).

Sorry... don't get an historian on a roll. He's sure to get carried away and drag himself well off topic.

Long story short - yes, that padding would offer some protection from points that got through, assuming the rest of the weapon didn't follow. And it would also offer protection from the force of the impact.

Nice job on that mail - I know a couple of guys who have made some and so am well aware of the dedication that a piece that size represents!

But seriously: you feel a need to wear chain mail to go shopping? Cripes.

LOL "Cripes" been a long time since I heard that last.

Originally Posted by Cangooner

*SNIP*

Many modern reproduction longbows are 50-70lb draw. Those recovered from the Mary Rose are estimated to have had draw weights from 100-185(!)lb. The force imparted by an arrow tipped with a properly designed bodkin head would made short work of mail and at close range punch right through contemporary plate armour (assuming it was not angled to deflect).

*SNIP*

I literally cannot imagine a bow with that kind of draw! I have experience with moderately "heavy" simple and compound bows, and those things will wear you out!

Back during the Dark Ages...no, not those Dark Ages...the late '60s...no, not THOSE '60s! I mean the late 1960s; the ones when I was attending junior high school! Anyway, one of my buddies decided to build a wooden crossbow as his woodworking shop final project. To make a long story short, he miscalculated the resulting draw, and it took two of us to just barely manage to cock the beast. We took it out to the school ball fields where he loaded up a bolt, aimed about 30°-40° above the horizon, and let her rip. That bolt cleared the full length of the football field, including the running track surrounding it, the adjacent two baseball diamonds and some empty space beyond, crossed the street and freaking BURIED itself in the Oklahoma hardpan in a (luckily) vacant lot approximately 300 yards away! We dug that bolt out of the ground, and began the walk back to the school with a healthy and somber respect for the weapon.

Its not done yet. here it is going down my arm...



Like I said it takes 2 hours to do 3 sq inches.

I order Whiting & Davis metalmesh when I need to do combat in slaughterhouses.

That wouldnt stand up to a swipe. Thats a knife protector.

Um...thats thin.

Originally Posted by HaiKarate

Um...thats thin.

Battle was limited to unintentional slips and stabs with 6" boning knives. True, we were not trying to slay people.

Hai, that's some excellent work there.

Cangooner is spot on with the English Longbows. Examinations of skeletal remains of the period even showed shoulder deformities which were attributed to the tremendous draw weights.
While chainmail would not stand up to such a weapon (for that matter neither will a level 2 bullet proof vest) it is still useful for a slashing or stabbing attack from a thug with a pocket knife.
I used to wear a chain vest sewn inside my leathers for that very reason, back when I spent too much time in the company of not so nice people.
I would love to get one made of stainless one of these days.