Thread: Standard Nagura from JNS

Can someone tell me what the standard Nagura that ships with say a Shuobudani Type 100 from JNS? There is a box to click if you want to add Nagura. I assumed this is a very fine finishing stone beyond Meijiro but less than Koma. Is this correct? I am getting the exact same edge on all my razors, and there is another level I am not hitting. I never get HHT off of the stone. I have to strop first. I realize that HHT is not the end all, but it is a gauge I use to see where the edge is. My edge is great WTG, but ATG needs work. Ultimately I want to get a 4 piece Asano Nagura from Botan to Koma but, if the tan Nagura I have is less than Meijiro then I will start with Meijiro. My progression has been Naniwa 3/8 then Coticule from mud to light slurry, then Shuobudani mud finishing on light slurry.

Thanks in advance for your guidance.

I don't know anything about that nagura, but my advice is this on a stone where you're getting marginal performance:
* shave with your marginal edge
* 10 very light passes, slow, be sure to get the entire edge of both sides of the razor on each pass. By light, I mean the absolute lightest you can do.
* linen then leather and shave again

Do that until the edge is the way you want it. In really great stones, I don't notice anything doing that.

In marginal stones, or stones where I'm not getting what I expect, I always get a better edge after a couple of repetitions of that. You're essentially bringing the bevels in close to the edge but not working all of the way to it, same as the old barbers used to say about "not ruining an edge by overhoning".

You say shubo mud. what is the mud? is it dmt slurry or other nagura or tomo nagura? How thick you start, how thin you finish? water only at the end? are you diluting? finish dry, wet?

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I re-read my post and the Shubuobudani mud was not clearly stated. The mud is from the Nagura. I dilute down the slurry to very light. Water only on this stone seems to go backwards. This was a recommendation from Maxim.

Coming off an 8k Naniwa you shouldn't need that much to finish an edge. Drop the coticule, and the mud. You can get slurry dulling from a heavy "mud" and that's what I see from your progression. Your taking the Naniwa edge away and starting over.

I go from an 8k Shapton to a Nakayama Maruichi with a very light Mejiro slurry. Skim milk consistency would be heavier than I use. Work that light slurry diluting to water or almost water. Then Tomo Nagura as light or lighter than the Mejiro.... diluting to water. If you don't have the Mejiro, then work the Tomo Nagura a little longer while diluting. I'm assuming Maksim sent a compatible Tomo with your stone based on what you selected.

Once you leave the 8k Naniwa your not so much sharpening as refining the edge for smoothness and "some" sharpening.

If you're honing a dull blade with just Jnats, then Botan, Tenjyou, and Mejiro with a heavier slurry on the Botan and Tenjyou, diluting down can work, but coming from the 8k Naniwa.......you're going backwards with "mud".



Howard

Originally Posted by Avenolpey

Can someone tell me what the standard Nagura that ships with say a Shuobudani Type 100 from JNS? There is a box to click if you want to add Nagura. I assumed this is a very fine finishing stone beyond Meijiro but less than Koma. Is this correct? I am getting the exact same edge on all my razors, and there is another level I am not hitting. I never get HHT off of the stone. I have to strop first. I realize that HHT is not the end all, but it is a gauge I use to see where the edge is. My edge is great WTG, but ATG needs work. Ultimately I want to get a 4 piece Asano Nagura from Botan to Koma but, if the tan Nagura I have is less than Meijiro then I will start with Meijiro. My progression has been Naniwa 3/8 then Coticule from mud to light slurry, then Shuobudani mud finishing on light slurry.

Thanks in advance for your guidance.

Technique. I have the same problem with only getting hht after stropping. I did my first edge today that was popping a hanging hair 1/2-5/8 out from where I was holding it straight off the stones.

I actually humbled myself and did what the senior members talk about. I lapped my stones til they were dead flat. I got a spray bottle for adding water. I counted my strokes. I focused on any dull spots. I really paid attention to detail. And I was rewarded with the best edge and best shave I've ever had.

Its all in the bevel and the correct time at each stage.

Originally Posted by Avenolpey

Can someone tell me what the standard Nagura that ships with say a Shuobudani Type 100 from JNS? There is a box to click if you want to add Nagura. I assumed this is a very fine finishing stone beyond Meijiro but less than Koma. Is this correct?

The seller would really be the best person to ask but.........if it is a tomonagura it should be very similar to the base stone & finer than koma.

This is what Maksim replied when I asked him earlier this year:

They are softer Tomo Naguras that you can use as finishing.
But also to smoothen out the stones after flattening

Cheers.

If they are tomonagura, you should get an acceptable edge from them. The fact that the edge is not better as the water becomes clear is strange.

Everyone has their own methods, but to see what a stone is going to do, I like to get a decent edge and then do a very large number of laps on the finish stone to see what it does to an edge. If it damages an edge, looking at the edge every 50 laps or so will tell you what it will do, and after a couple of hundred on clear water, I have an idea of just what the stone will do with varying pressures (obviously finishing with light pressure).

There is also the opportunity to see what the stone feels like - is it smooth, does it feel grabby or scratchy at all, is it always consistent, etc.

I wouldn't get too concerned about whether or not I got good HHT results without stropping, I'd be concerned about whether or not I had a good shave *after* stropping.