Thread: Honing Question

OK...we're zeroing in the range now....

You don't need just one bevel setting ever, but you only need the bevel re-set once in a long, long while. Once a bevel is set well, if no damage is done, BUT you slip from (in your terms) uber sharp (in mine, comfortable and effective), then it may be time to go back to the hones, first a finisher (12k?) to see if you can bring it back with a simple refreshing, IF NOT, then to the 8k, and if not with it to 5-4k. In other works, you work at getting your razor's edge back by removing the least amount of metal on a finer grit stone and move back down the stone fineness scale.

Hope that makes sense. Otherwise you're just eating away the edge of a fine razor.

Originally Posted by JOB15

My thought process has been wrong for a long time.
I thought that its the bevel setting that gives the initial sharpness of the the edge, then the rest of the honing regime is just smoothening out that edge.
Therefore when the edge is no longer uber sharp , a bevel setting was the only way to get back that uber deadly sharpness.
But apparently you only need one bevel setting ever.
We live and learn..... slowly

Originally Posted by feltspanky

I recently purchased four new gold dollars razors off ebay. The cost was around seventeen dollars including shipping. They're great razors for honing practice They will take an edge and pass the HHT test. It took over a month for them to arrive. There really is a slow boat from China. Save the steel on heirloom straight razors and practice on the GD's.

JOB15 -- you said you wanted to practice honing...that's what feltspanky is doing.

On the other hand, if you want to chew the steel away on your good razors for "practice" and no other reason, they're yours....go ahead.

Originally Posted by Haroldg48

JOB15 -- you said you wanted to practice honing...that's what feltspanky is doing.

On the other hand, if you want to chew the steel away on your good razors for "practice" and no other reason, they're yours....go ahead.

Yeh but practicing honing ends with a shave, for me... and only the finest steel is allowed to touch my preciouses face
OK I cant win that argument , learning to hone on good razors is a no no.
I have a new Baxters BCX blade, I set the bevel and polished it. The shaves were perfect, I had a number of shaves.
Then took back to the Nakayama .
The first shave off that was a bit to sharp , the second which I had yesterday was amazing, the best shave I can recall.
So I'm on a mission now to see how long I can keep this blade without setting the bevel.
I'll take your advise , try to keep it tip top using the finer grit and when I have to getting coarser .

Originally Posted by JOB15

But how do they shave?
HHT is some thing I don't do anymore.
For me a razor has to look good under the microscope and to the naked eye, pop mid level arm hair.
That normally ensures a good edge.
Ultimately its the shave test that tells and I wouldn't shave with a cheepo blade.


We only live once (that's questionable actually) so why save stuff.

Use it and enjoy it

The shave is decent, The scales are cheap plastic, The blades don't center squarely between the scales. I'm not expecting a lot of aesthetics from a four dollar razor. They make adequate razors for learning to set bevels, honing, and reviewing edges under magnification.

Originally Posted by ocelot27

You can get a great vintage razor with great steel off eBay and use that to practice - save your expensive razors! You should only need a polishing stone to refresh a well stropped, well honed razor that has a properly set bevel IMO. I have a very thick beard too and shave every other day and go many weeks before taking a razor back to my hones - and I don't use any pasted drops between honings.

John

I respectfully disagree with the advice of using vintage razors to practice honing on just because they can be bought cheap. If it's in poor shape then yes but vintage razors in great shape deserve a little more respect IMHO. The fact is they don't make them anymore and regardless of the price, they should not be considered "practice" razors. I've read this advice before and I would rather see a more expensive modern razor potentially damaged than a "cheap" vintage razor that's in good condition. Modern razors can be replaced.

Well, brother, look on the bright side. It sounds like you have some valuable experience already gained: You know how to set on mean bevel.

Bevel setting came later in my learning process. For me, its just that, a process. Success today does not guarantee success tomorrow. So true for many things in life, I find.

I also like to go back over and re-immerse myself on the coat-tails of those with the oodles of experience that I lack.

k/r
Simon

Originally Posted by mattluthier

I respectfully disagree with the advice of using vintage razors to practice honing on just because they can be bought cheap. If it's in poor shape then yes but vintage razors in great shape deserve a little more respect IMHO. The fact is they don't make them anymore and regardless of the price, they should not be considered "practice" razors. I've read this advice before and I would rather see a more expensive modern razor potentially damaged than a "cheap" vintage razor that's in good condition. Modern razors can be replaced.

I agree - most of my most treasured razors are vintage. But there are ones worth preserving and ones that are good for practice - better to practice with good steel than a gold dollar.

John

Originally Posted by JOB15

Recently ive been touching up blades on my jnats . It might be to early to tell but I think its not quite the same edge as a fresh bevel set and polish.
So I will to go back to the 8k and carry on from there.

That's exactly what you should be doing. If you still find differences between 'freshly honed' and 'touched up' then go back further to 4k and go from there.

Being really good at honing isn't about getting a razor sharp, it's getting it there with the minimum amount of work necessary. That's the hardest part that most people don't seem to quite get - assessing the edge correctly.

Dulling the blade and starting from a more well-defined state is just a prop to help beginners who lack the expertise to evaluate it correctly - but eventually after you have one sure way to make a razor sharp you should start working on loosing the training wheels.

So, it seems to me you're doing pretty much everything right, now that you have more experience and start to understand what is happening, you want to begin dropping the steps that you no longer need.

You should be getting more shaves than every 4 times. You shouldn't have to hone that much. How is your stropping technique? Are you getting your razor sharp enough once you hone it & strop it? People tend to get their stropping technique slightly off which would cause you to maybe feel like you need to hone again when you really shouldn't be. Make sure you are holding your strop taut at all times & strop correctly. One bad stroke of the strop can dull your razor & make it less sharp. Try practicing stropping more rather than honing that often & see where that gets ya. Next time you hone, make sure you are using no pressure on the blade. Once you have gone through your progressions, strop it with very little or no pressure at all, like petting a dog on it's head. Once you are done stropping, you should have a very sharp razor & your shave should be very comfortable. You might even consider getting a pre shave & using it, then shave. You should not have to hone so much. Like everyone else said, get an eBay special but a good one to practice honing & stropping. Sometimes it takes time getting the method down just right.

Thanks for all the advise, that's what I wanted.
At the moment I'm trying to fix all the uneven edges I've created over the past year or so.
Using a sharpie and very light touch honing on the 1K is getting them flat again.
No need to do rocking strokes or whatever, just get them flat.
Also instead of pressing down on the blade I'm using torque and really keeping an eye on the swarf coming off the blade. Easy enough to do on the white Shaptons.
I've found that each stone has to be learnt, synthetics through the grits as well as naturals .