Thread: Hone questions

Well it's not really a trade secret, it's just a matter of mechanics. Often the hones that degrade after lapping are those that were resin bound. The abrasive and resin are mixed and then pressed.

Just like concrete, it's an aggregate of multiple materials and sizes of material, and the top surface is usually the finest. Lapping these down too far can result in a coarser hone. The same goes for those hones that the binder softens on over time - they were never meant to release much of their grit - and if they do it can be disastrous for the razor edge.

The barber hones that have a clay binder and are fired as well as the silicon carbide barber hones such as Carboloy seem to be okay to lap/flatten as long as you bring them up to a very high finish afterward. Others I would be wary of lapping unless you don't mind losing the hone if it goes bad.

The ones with clay binders are specifically the ones I'm thinking of. If I had any idea a B. hone was made of resin I wouldn't attempt it for all of the reasons you mentioned. But I figure the clay ones had to be surfaced at the factory, and I imagine they had some simple/quick method of getting it done.

I doubt they spent the same amount of time surfacing each individual stone that I have sanding the Swaty flat, polishing it, then burnishing. Well, I'm sure right out of the kiln they'd really only have to burnish the hones, but my question is what method did they use for that? Sanding disc, stone grinding wheel, cloth buffing wheel with paste, good old fashioned Arkansas stone and elbow grease?

I'm not clear as to why one would buy a barber's hone when you can get a cut down 12k Chinese hone for $15 from WD?

Originally Posted by gcbryan

I'm not clear as to why one would buy a barber's hone when you can get a cut down 12k Chinese hone for $15 from WD?

As a wise old fart who lives in the boonies of Idaho says; "Naturals are a Romance, Synthetics are a Science". With the Made by the C. H. Ina naturals they vary. However the grits in the barber hones were precisely graded. I'll take a good barbers hone over any C. H. Ina natural any day (Including the one I own).

Basically what cudarunner said. Naturals are a crapshoot, there are people with the Chinese "12K" that can't get anywhere near a 6K edge off the hone. Not all of them behave the same. Some are medium grit and not at all comfortable to shave with, some have inclusions that make them unfit for honing (or need to be dug out).

Barber hones are something of a crapshoot too. You'll notice most aren't graded by any form of grit rating. But usually you can count on them being somewhere in the 8K ball park, some a little higher, some a little lower, but most will leave you with an edge you can shave with if the hone's in good condition. A barber's hone will also get you where you want to be faster. 5-10 strokes on a barber's hone every couple of weeks and your edge will never need to see another hone. If you've got a good Chinese 12K, I'm willing to bet you'd do 10x that amount at a bare minimum when you need a refresh. I usually do more along the lines of 150 to 200.

Knowing what I know now, if I lost all my hones in some horrible boating accident and was given the choice between a barber hone and a Chinese 12K...give me the barber hone.

Originally Posted by Marshal

Basically what cudarunner said. Naturals are a crapshoot, there are people with the Chinese "12K" that can't get anywhere near a 6K edge off the hone. Not all of them behave the same. Some are medium grit and not at all comfortable to shave with, some have inclusions that make them unfit for honing (or need to be dug out).

Barber hones are something of a crapshoot too. You'll notice most aren't graded by any form of grit rating. But usually you can count on them being somewhere in the 8K ball park, some a little higher, some a little lower, but most will leave you with an edge you can shave with if the hone's in good condition. A barber's hone will also get you where you want to be faster. 5-10 strokes on a barber's hone every couple of weeks and your edge will never need to see another hone. If you've got a good Chinese 12K, I'm willing to bet you'd do 10x that amount at a bare minimum when you need a refresh. I usually do more along the lines of 150 to 200.

Knowing what I know now, if I lost all my hones in some horrible boating accident and was given the choice between a barber hone and a Chinese 12K...give me the barber hone.

Would that logic not apply to Jnats as well?

Jnats are outside of my realm of experience. I don't own any, and haven't really had a chance to use them. So if you're asking would I choose a barber hone over a Jnat, yes - I would have to defer to the known quantity.

If you're asking if Jnats are hit and miss...well, they're still a naturally formed rock with no form of manufacturing quality control. They can have inclusions, and while the surface layer may make an excellent hone, you go down an eighth of an inch and there may be a very different type of material hidden beneath the good stuff you were using. But, it is also my opinion that Jnats are graded better than the Guangxi/Chinese 12K hones are. Sort of a you get what you pay for affair. Someone pays $400 for a Jnat, that puppy better work at least for a little while. Someone paid $40 for a Chinese hone? Exchange it for another rock and hope the second one suits them better.

I've had three C12K hones all very different, one fabulous, one very nice and one simply just ok. You will also have to do many laps as they are slow. Don't get me wrong, I love the edges from my best one, they just might not be for everyone and there is a learning curve just like any natural.

Barber hones and all synthetics are all very consistent

Originally Posted by gcbryan

I'm not clear as to why one would buy a barber's hone when you can get a cut down 12k Chinese hone for $15 from WD?

So it seems we have lots opinions and good reasons for them, but I got to thinking where do the tri hone set up and the Arkansas stones fit in?


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Originally Posted by RickWY

So it seems we have lots opinions and good reasons for them, but I got to thinking where do the tri hone set up and the Arkansas stones fit in?

Norton Tri Hones are Only for Knives. At least in my humble opinion.

As far as the Arks go, I've only played with a hard black so I'm unqualified to answer.