Thread: Using oil with coticule questions

I have a 5"x2" extremely hard coticule that I like to use time to time. I only use the coticule for finishing so I was thinking about using some sort of honing oil.

How much of a difference has using honing oil on a coti made for you guys?
What are long term effects of using oil on a coticule?
honing oil suggestions? (never used honing oil before)
How do I handle coticule after honing session? Do I clean it up somehow or just leave it as is if I am only using it with oil after?



I don't really mind if the coticule had to be used with oil only since I only use it for finishing a blade or two.
Pictures of the stone if you are curious https://imgur.com/a/fv7wH I believe it is a la dressante coticule

Instead of oil why not try Glycerine first. It'll thicken up water a touch but unlike oil it's not going to impregnate the stone and change it's characteristics if the stone is porous.

You should be able to get a small bottle from a pharmacy. I think you guys call them drug stores.

Other names for the same stuff are. Glycerol, glycerin, And it's the VG component in E cig liquid.

If you've got an extremely hard coticule. Oil will not penetrate the surface and you can easily wash it off post honing with dish soap.

Oil can make the finish on a stone a bit better just by giving it some cushion. A hydroplaning technique. I enjoyed using it. Some coticule responds really well to oil.

Long term. If you clean it after every use... Nothing... If you don't.... Nothing. Like a hard black or translucent arkansas. Easy to wash any oil off because it doesn't penetrate the surface.

A couple water soluble oils are smiths honing oil and ballistol oil. I use Ballistol oil (liquid not the spray) on my Arkansas stones and dilute it 50-50 with water. Being water soluble these oils will wash righ off your stones easily and work as a honing oil should IMO.

So what happens if I use coticule as oil stone and overtime the oil did penatrate the surface. Would it just be an oil only stone? Or would it need to be lapped until it was a clean surface

If it did penetrate you would struggle to use water on it in the future. As the water would bead off. And it might have a long term effect on the glue of a backed coticule. You may also find the hone looses it's abrasive power under slurries making it a finishing or near finishing stone without the ability to reset a bevel. For a razor only stone this isn't going to be a problem but if you wanted to use it for knives as well you may have slowed it to the point of been useless.

It's your stone so do what you want with it. I personally wouldn't use oil unless I had to, but then I do a 1 stone method when the coticule comes out.

I would also never buy a coti that I knew had been used with oil, Because I don't like anything oily getting near my synthetics.

Coticules are non-porous, but from your picture, if the cracks in the stone are not sealed, then all bets are off.

Oil and Cotis are about as contentious around the forums as Tape, & GD's

But when there are products like Smith's and Balistol that are water soluble readily available it is simply a non-issue.

I stopped using actual Oil years ago, the products above give as good if not better edges even on Arkies and Charnley's with ZERO risk of contaminating a Waterstone. They also allow you to adjust the Viscosity at anytime during honing...

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Oil and Cotis are about as contentious around the forums as Tape, & GD's

But when there are products like Smith's and Balistol that are water soluble readily available it is simply a non-issue.
,,,,

Yes many discussions and opinions.

There is a third option for a Coti so:
1) water, 2) oil or 3) running water (even running oil).

Because we are discussing finishing stones running water to eliminate
any slurry produces a very different edge then if a self-slurry is allowed
to build up even a little. Try ten final hone strokes under running water
on the last hone.

Water and oil are basically used to keep the stone from clogging with
swarff (mix of steel and stone powder) . Too much swarff (debris or waste) and the stone
can stop cutting a little or a lot. So for a hone to cut steel it needs something
to keep it clean enough.

For a finisher allowing the rock to clog up a bit or even a lot can make it abrade a log gentler than
it would if it was clean. This can produce a smoother edge in some cases. Older carbide hones
like the 101 were often loaded with Vaseline to improve their "finishing" qualities.

The coticle is often used with a dilution slurry process starting with slurry and then diluting that slurry
constantly to the point of clear water. In the extreme the clear water step can be
followed with a running water step.

So for a razor that shaved yesterday but just a bit rough one might touch it up (re finish it)
under running water. Alternatively the hone can be allowed to collect swarff even to the
point of glazing over to finish/ maintain an edge.

Oil goes bad... machine shops pay dearly for cutting oil and replace it quite often so it does
not do bad things to people and machines. Rancid oil is acidic, sticky and gummy.
If oil is used the oil needs to be replenished to keep it from going off. Old school oil
could be animal, vegetable or less likely petroleum. Old is not so old in this sport of
shaving so opinions can have formed from who knows what oil.
Since cotis have been used for centuries all manner of oil would have been tried
and the bad ones could not be removed then for want of modern detergents and solvents.

A water based honing solution like Smiths would hold slurry of a self slurry and rinse from
a coti in the dilution steps. But finishing does not need the quicker steel removing slurry
steps and I would finish or refinish under running water.

If that did not refinish the edge I would allow some self slurry action and
if that did not I would reach for a Shapton or slurry stone perhaps with Smith's
magic solution.

Finishing is a black art. You can begin to see the eyes of a hone master almost glow
when switching from bevel setting and honing to final finishing. The room gets a bit
quieter, hearts beat slower, voices get calmer sharpening is over and finishing happens
but not until it is time.

Oil does prevent rust... rust bothers an edge, strop dressing has some oil
in it so visit a strop if the last rock was not oiled before putting the razor up.

Oiling razors today is easy ... pick a people safe oil that is safe for your scales
and apply almost none. WD-40 has its place ;-)

Originally Posted by Brontosaurus

Very nice. And "huile de Vaseline" is mineral oil by another name. As is "huile de paraffine," the latter being the pharmaceutical grade version.

Aha nice, I was wondering about that a bit, thanks for clearing that up!

I find notes / or carved initials, numbers in razors or scales, etc etc all very interesting, adds to the fun aspects of our hobby

Originally Posted by niftyshaving

For a finisher allowing the rock to clog up a bit or even a lot can make it abrade a log gentler than
it would if it was clean. This can produce a smoother edge in some cases.

Very good point, that's why I regret lapping my great grandfather's Coticule, it seems it had taken decades to the state it was in, the surface was smoothed out by clogging and being used by oil.
Something I could replicate, but since there was no running water during his time that seems like a very convenient no mess alternative nowadays