Thread: Suehiro Stones

Originally Posted by earcutter

It’s remarkable how on board I am with you on the size thing. I’ve slowly begun to amass a a collection of 6” x 2” everything. I have a complete set of Arks in 6x2, the DMTs in 6x2, a Coti as close to 6x2 as I could, and now i’ll be getting those Dual Stone synthetics in 6x2’s.

That’s by design. Every one of those items comes in 8x3, I just really like a 6x2. Especially when I’m in the mood to palm hone. I know many will think it silly that I prefer the 6x2’s over the 3x8’s, but then, I collect 4/8’s so... lol.

Yes, bigger is not always better, and that spans the range, brushes included, in my opinion. I've gone so far as to acquire cheapish larger synths and cut them down to a smaller size with a tile saw. I have a nice set of 5" x 2" Eden synths here, cut down from I don't remember, something like 7-3/4" x 2-1/2". The leftover pieces, I use for matching "naguras" to clean swarf and even smaller travel stones.

That said, I think the softer synths and stones at the earlier stages prefer a larger surface area than the finishing stones, this moving in tandem with the type of stroke being used. For me, it's more up-and-down, half-lap style at the start, then moving to X-strokes or rolling Xs, ending with laterally-biassed strokes. And from this, I've sort of arrived at an ideal proportion of 2.5:1 based on the 5" x 2" barber hone of old. So at the early chip removal-reshaping stage for hand-held using up-and-down, half-lap type strokes, the ideal format would be 6" x 2-1/2", followed by 5" x 2" for the so-called bevel-setting to middle range, and ending with 4" x 1-5/8" for the lateral-biassed passes with the finishers. And this can be scaled down further as needed--e.g., 5" x 2" for chips and reshaping, 4" x 1-5/8" for bevel-setting/mid-range, and 3" x ~1-1/4" for finishing on a dime.

Originally Posted by earcutter

It’s remarkable how on board I am with you on the size thing. I’ve slowly begun to amass a a collection of 6” x 2” everything. I have a complete set of Arks in 6x2, the DMTs in 6x2, a Coti as close to 6x2 as I could, and now i’ll be getting those Dual Stone synthetics in 6x2’s.

That’s by design. Every one of those items comes in 8x3, I just really like a 6x2. Especially when I’m in the mood to palm hone. I know many will think it silly that I prefer the 6x2’s over the 3x8’s, but then, I collect 4/8’s so... lol.

Earcutter,
It appears you have HAD, like many of us. I feel the need to tell you though, its potentially dangerous, and hope it doesn't interfere with your quality of life. As for myself, for years, I've passed more days eating 0.40¢ ramen without taste than I care to admit, a rather bad situation. I've lost a lot of weight, and that's good I suppose, but I digress.
And I feel like my case is a warning for many of us. HAD is potentially dangerous; not always bad but in some cases, well, it might interfere with someone's quality of life like kind of me.

Back to the topic now! I have tested many of the classic suehiro and cerax/new cerax stones, and I have to say I was satisfied from all of them, their makers know their stuff!
The classic red 1k (that looks exactly like a king 1k on appearance but is actually a bit softer) as I said is a bit too soft for my taste, and the rika is soft too, to a lesser degree I'd say.
Especially for the red 1k, some would like this, and feels extremely like a natural stone (the rika 5k too), but that much slurry is too much! And the harder, more wear resistant steels don't like soft stones generally, from my experience.
As for Cerax/New cerax, they are reliable and work fine on all steels without that much slurry. I like them a lot, and are generally a bit cheaper from their competition, without being of lower quality, good all around stones (darn, my opinion on them turned out kind of like an advertisement, but it's not, I just love reliable hones, and sharp edges!)
As for size, I have to agree, on knives I prefer the 6x2"-8x2" size on pretty much any type of stone. If wider, you have to rotate the stone constantly and hone near the edges too, and it takes time to keep the stone from getting hollow on a small area, and then having to lap it for about as long as you were honing your knife.

The Suehiro 1k/3ks I've used have always been blue on one side (1k) and off-white on the other (3k). Adding confusion to this that the Cerax line on the German sites are sometimes shown as blue for 1k, identical in color to the traditional Suehiro synth, and sometimes brick red like a King. And for American and Asian markets, the 1k Cerax is sometimes shown as white. My experience with the Suehiros has only been with the traditional blue/off-white combos. To me, they do not seem softer than King stones and it is easier to remove standing swarf from their surfaces. One cannot add a lot of pressure to them when honing, but it's not like I've ever dug into one while honing.

Originally Posted by Brontosaurus

The Suehiro 1k/3ks I've used have always been blue on one side (1k) and off-white on the other (3k). Adding confusion to this that the Cerax line on the German sites are sometimes shown as blue for 1k, identical in color to the traditional Suehiro synth, and sometimes brick red like a King. And for American and Asian markets, the 1k Cerax is sometimes shown as white. My experience with the Suehiros has only been with the traditional blue/off-white combos. To me, they do not seem softer than King stones and it is easier to remove standing swarf from their surfaces. One cannot add a lot of pressure to them when honing, but it's not like I've ever dug into one while honing.

I guess I need to add that, the red 1k stone, akamon I think is known, is the softest, what I was talking about, for me.
For the finer of the classic not cerax line, I feel like they too are softer than ceramic or magnesia (or other binders like it) stones.
I don't really mind, but honing a good knife on the 1k with a little pressure, and the slurry starts to flow everywhere. It's not unpleasant and I have seen it on natural stones like few Aoto. And the haze surface it leaves is awesome, if you've got pattern welded/Damascus/san mai/hamon etc. steel/in your steel, it looks awesome, few stones can give such contrast. Still, if I'm the only one who thinks that, I guess it would be a YMMV case.

Originally Posted by Vasilis

Earcutter,
It appears you have HAD, like many of us. I feel the need to tell you though, its potentially dangerous, and hope it doesn't interfere with your quality of life. As for myself, for years, I've passed more days eating 0.40¢ ramen without taste than I care to admit, a rather bad situation. I've lost a lot of weight, and that's good I suppose, but I digress.
And I feel like my case is a warning for many of us. HAD is potentially dangerous; not always bad but in some cases, well, it might interfere with someone's quality of life like kind of me.

Thank you for your concern. Though I certainly didn’t “need” the stones I’ve been buying, they aren’t altering my quality of life in any negative way. What might though, is buying more knives/straights to sharpen lol!

I think I should start honing knives for the neighbors lol!

I got my little 1K/3K stone in today! Woot!




Just a quick FYI, if you want to trace over the copy with a permanent marker so you’ll never forget what side is what, do it right away. A quick soak later and the stamped grits have all but practically disappeared.

The rubber stand is remarkably effective. It really is rubber. I mean it’s soft and holds onto a wet countertop. Color me impressed!




Now I’m not going to lie, for such a small stone, I doubt I’ll ever use the stand, preferring to palm hone, but I’m going to use it on my 6x2’s. It’ll hold a “larger” stone in place.

Anyway, I drew the pencil lines on it and gave it a lapping with my DMT. Initially, I was a little worried. A. Because it was so soft I was done in no time, and B. Because it was so soft I was done in no time lol! Moreover, that line you see between the stones, is hollow. I don’t know how deep that extends, I’d need some dental floss to figure it, but it held with a pretty good soak, so yay!




APPLICATION:

So here was the real test. I grabbed a 6” chef knife, dulled it, and then went at it. That soft I was fearing - yup, the stone gets dirty fast! But it cut soooo smooth! I totally loved the feel (and effect later). But feared I’d need to Lapp it after every use to get rid of “the dirty” - nope! A little running water and my thumb and balm. Gone. It’s as though it has more chalk in it or something.

More chalk or not, I have no idea. What I do know is I like the way this stone cuts WAY more than my Nani!! Way more.

Now that’s VERY premature to say, but I am impressed. I love the little thing. I’ll report back when I use it on a razor. In the meantime however, for under $20, go get yourself some!

Originally Posted by earcutter

I got my little 1K/3K stone in today! Woot!




Just a quick FYI, if you want to trace over the copy with a permanent marker so you’ll never forget what side is what, do it right away. A quick soak later and the stamped grits have all but practically disappeared.

The rubber stand is remarkably effective. It really is rubber. I mean it’s soft and holds onto a wet countertop. Color me impressed!




Now I’m not going to lie, for such a small stone, I doubt I’ll ever use the stand, preferring to palm hone, but I’m going to use it on my 6x2’s. It’ll hold a “larger” stone in place.

Anyway, I drew the pencil lines on it and gave it a lapping with my DMT. Initially, I was a little worried. A. Because it was so soft I was done in no time, and B. Because it was so soft I was done in no time lol! Moreover, that line you see between the stones, is hollow. I don’t know how deep that extends, I’d need some dental floss to figure it, but it held with a pretty good soak, so yay!




APPLICATION:

So here was the real test. I grabbed a 6” chef knife, dulled it, and then went at it. That soft I was fearing - yup, the stone gets dirty fast! But it cut soooo smooth! I totally loved the feel (and effect later). But feared I’d need to Lapp it after every use to get rid of “the dirty” - nope! A little running water and my thumb and balm. Gone. It’s as though it has more chalk in it or something.

More chalk or not, I have no idea. What I do know is I like the way this stone cuts WAY more than my Nani!! Way more.

Now that’s VERY premature to say, but I am impressed. I love the little thing. I’ll report back when I use it on a razor. In the meantime however, for under $20, go get yourself some!

I have the same stone, sometimes the smaller stone is good I have a few small penknives that I sharpen sometimes, it does a great job so I cant complain, esp for the great price,

I used it again tonight on a very stubborn knife of questionable metal. This time I didn’t soak it, I just sprayed it. I noted the water never pooled on any spray until it was “ready” to go. In other words, the stone absorbed the water instantly. Like a paper towel. And just like a paper towel, as soon as it was saturated, it pooled and stayed there. Kind of cool.

When using the stone, I keep feeling as though the stone is so soft, that where I to hone anymore, I’ll thin the stone out to nothing. But that’s the thing, it’s so soft, its smooth. Don’t get me wrong, it gives you feedback. It’s not that soft. You can tell if you still need to use the grit and on what side it’s needed most etc., etc. I don’t know how to explain it other than as before - it seems as though it has more chalk in it than other synthetics. It’s a pleasure to use, which might lead to overhoning.

Who knows what the longevity will be. I can’t wait to see what the “Dual Stone” series will feel like!

Originally Posted by Botanic

Soft + yellow\cream + 3000:
1.Suehiro new Cerax 3000 new
- middle soft stone, softer than naniwa SuperStone.
Two mods:
with plastic base. https://www.suehiro-toishi.com/en/ce.../cr-3000-y-re/
or combo with blue 1000 jis cerax https://www.suehiro-toishi.com/en/ce...ax/cr-3800-re/

2.Suehiro Kouga 3000
- softer, with wood stand.
.. Due to appearance it must be this one
https://www.suehiro-toishi.com/en/gyomu/3000/
..no base edition https://www.suehiro-toishi.com/en/gyomu/3000-35/
I bouight my stone there Suehiro 'Kouga' #3000 finishing stone. Small. : Tools from Japan, Japanese woodworking tools direct from Japan.
name "kouga" -- the same source.

3.Suehiro SKG
(double sided: 1000 + 3000) - cheapest one. I didn't use it - don't know about it. It's a softer than cerax new and not so pure was said.
https://www.suehiro-toishi.com/en/kitchen/skg-43/

Yes, the Suehiro Kouga 3000 is it.

Update 2/3:

I got my second Suehiro stone in today! Woot!



It’s a 280/1,000 combo stone.

Comes with a nice little rubber thing to hold her down. It’s a nice touch.




Anyway, I of course decided to lap it right away. When I wet the 280 side, this is what I saw.



It was kind of odd, and I can’t think of any reason why the center would soak up so much moisture compared to the sides. Really odd. I’ll make sure to soak and lap it a few more times. In spite of this though it cut like a champ! I SO like the feel of these stones over the Nani’s. But the Nani’s have done me justice for a while, so I got to see how these act over time.



One thing is for sure, both of these stones are small. This one however is an odd size compared to the rectangular shapes I’m used to. It’s approximately a 4 x 3 stone. And I loved it. I did a small pairing knife and a 6” chef knife to test it out - the size is awesome!

I wonder if the rectangle shaped stone is a take-off of quarried stone or something, because this shape works! You’d think every synthetic maker would sell one this size/shape.


Pretty happy. And if USPS is to be believed, my “Dual Stones” will arrive tomorrow! I can’t wait lol. It’s like Christmas.