Thread: Advice needed

Post some pic of your razor, as clear and close as you can get, for more detailed advice.

Yes, you need finer stones, start with known grit quality synthetic stone, natural stones are of unknown grit and may take your learning curve backwards.

Pics

Originally Posted by PaulFLUS

Preface: I AM NOT A HONEMEISTER. JUST A GUY WHO MANAGES TO MAINTAIN HIS OWN.

Ditto what steel said. I guess I was too dumb to know what not to do. It probably would have been easier if I had my dad show me when he was doing it (he had a sharpening business when I was a kid) but I was young, dumb and full of...vinegar. I had to learn the hard way from a lot of mistakes...but now I'm hijacking.

You have to know at least what a dull razor is which it sounds like you do. You probably don't have the right stones to acheive what you want. Norton makes a good kit that is about $150 US with 2 double sided hones, 220/1k, 4k/8k and a leveling stone. That covers a lot of ground fairly cheaply.
Dave (rolodave) is right though. It is a LOT easier to start with one that already has a decent bevel and edge and learn to maintain then hone, then bevel set backwards from there. Maybe that is why I didn't screw up more than I did. My heirloom from my Dad (rip Dad) was nearly shave ready when I got it and his barber hones. Muddled through refreshing then learned more, blah, blah, blah... You get the picture.
I always suggest the 4k/8k pyramid progression (these other guys are probably rolling their eyes now) which you can find in the library, because it was where things really went from messing with this and that to a method which had consistent results without fail. Definitely watch gssixgun's videos because that will teach you a LOT about technique in stroke, pressure, angles etc. After that, whatever progression or method you use will be a lot more successful. But first you are going to need some hones. My suggestion is to start with synthetic (man-made) rather than quarried (natural) stones because they are easier to learn and you have a better grip on the grit range. Good luck and don't give up. Also, you are well advised to start with a razor that is not an heirloom or fancy expensive one. If you need junkers to practice with I'll be glad to send you a couple.

I never seem to be able to find razors to practice on around here... All I ever see are 150 to 200 dollar razors and I would be afraid to practice on something that cost that much....

Originally Posted by jaro1069

I never seem to be able to find razors to practice on around here... All I ever see are 150 to 200 dollar razors and I would be afraid to practice on something that cost that much....

Are u looking in antique shops. I don't know your actual location, but I find them all over the place.

I've picked up hundreds, for 20$ or less. Only 3 come to mind that I paid $100 or more, and they were new production, or semi custom

Originally Posted by jaro1069

I never seem to be able to find razors to practice on around here... All I ever see are 150 to 200 dollar razors and I would be afraid to practice on something that cost that much....

Oh jeez you can find plenty on E-Bay for under $50 that will turn out to be great shavers.

Look for vintage razors... browse the "buy it now" options...

@ IvonPaul

If your competent at sharpening knives, once you have the proper hones you'll do just fine. Most will say that the razor is harder than a knife, to hone. Not so, in my opinion. A knife must be held by hand to obtain the proper angle, unless you have a jig that holds it, where the razor lays flat on the stone, and the spine holds the proper angle. The only difference is we typically don't refine a knife, as much as a razor.

You seem to be very much like myself. I learned how to hone knives, axes, machete's and such, very early in life ( 7-8 years old ). At 17, I decided I wanted to shave with a straight, so I did, but I had only one stone that I thought was fine enough, (1000 or 2000 grt.) and shaved off that edge for many years till I learned of the different hones needed for straights.

A bit of advice....tape your spines.
Look thru the library, watch videos, ( stay away from Dr. Matt ) learn the different techniques and strokes for the various grinds of razors.
Have a razor pro honed, for a comparison tool when you hone another.
And have patience, they take a lot longer to hone, than a knife. Especially ones that have been damaged, or are old wedges with heavy spine wear, those with warped n twisted spines and blades.

This is when the $#1+ hit the fan, and razors become truly harder to hone, than knives.

I think you'll do just fine.!
Have fun, enjoy your time on the rocks.
Make sure you lap your new hones.

Originally Posted by jaro1069

I never seem to be able to find razors to practice on around here... All I ever see are 150 to 200 dollar razors and I would be afraid to practice on something that cost that much....

There are no antique shops close to me. I was trying to focus on the honing and not the issues the razors may have, so I learned on NOS and new production razors. I used tape and was careful. Everything was fine. The reall honing challenge came from eBay razors. Geometry issues and restoration work are a different level of honing. I have no regrets on how I started, other than it would have been nice to be able to go to a meet when I started.

Originally Posted by PaulFLUS

Preface: I AM NOT A HONEMEISTER. JUST A GUY WHO MANAGES TO MAINTAIN HIS OWN.

Ditto what steel said. I guess I was too dumb to know what not to do. It probably would have been easier if I had my dad show me when he was doing it (he had a sharpening business when I was a kid) but I was young, dumb and full of...vinegar. I had to learn the hard way from a lot of mistakes...but now I'm hijacking.

You have to know at least what a dull razor is which it sounds like you do. You probably don't have the right stones to acheive what you want. Norton makes a good kit that is about $150 US with 2 double sided hones, 220/1k, 4k/8k and a leveling stone. That covers a lot of ground fairly cheaply.
Dave (rolodave) is right though. It is a LOT easier to start with one that already has a decent bevel and edge and learn to maintain then hone, then bevel set backwards from there. Maybe that is why I didn't screw up more than I did. My heirloom from my Dad (rip Dad) was nearly shave ready when I got it and his barber hones. Muddled through refreshing then learned more, blah, blah, blah... You get the picture.
I always suggest the 4k/8k pyramid progression (these other guys are probably rolling their eyes now) which you can find in the library, because it was where things really went from messing with this and that to a method which had consistent results without fail. Definitely watch gssixgun's videos because that will teach you a LOT about technique in stroke, pressure, angles etc. After that, whatever progression or method you use will be a lot more successful. But first you are going to need some hones. My suggestion is to start with synthetic (man-made) rather than quarried (natural) stones because they are easier to learn and you have a better grip on the grit range. Good luck and don't give up. Also, you are well advised to start with a razor that is not an heirloom or fancy expensive one. If you need junkers to practice with I'll be glad to send you a couple.

Originally Posted by outback

Are u looking in antique shops. I don't know your actual location, but I find them all over the place.

I've picked up hundreds, for 20$ or less. Only 3 come to mind that I paid $100 or more, and they were new production, or semi custom

Originally Posted by HungeJ0e

Oh jeez you can find plenty on E-Bay for under $50 that will turn out to be great shavers.

Look for vintage razors... browse the "buy it now" options...

Yes I have seen them on eBay but those kind of worry me because I like to see "in hand in person" the razor first before buying because the eBay ones I have heard plenty of horror stories of cracked and broken in half and twisted blades

Can't blame ya on that one, I feel the same way. I'll drive 50 miles one way, just to look over some blades, but also to meet people and maybe get some insite to where some may be hiding.

I’ve been through the learning process and still feel sorry for that one eBay razor that suffered my first bevel set 11 years ago, it suffered cruel and unusual punishment. But I learned pretty fast, lol.

My idea of learning to hone is still a little different than most others. While it’s true that beginners almost invariably use too much pressure, and too much pressure on the spine, I still think that you should learn without tape, unless you’re learning on a valuable/pretty/nice razor, then by all means tape the spine.

If you use too much pressure on the spine, as I did, you’ll see that and figure out something’s not right. If you tape the spine and use too much pressure, you won’t see that wear and won’t know that you need to lighten up, at least you’re likely to not know as fast. You need to be learning on a common razor that isn’t valuable or is ‘expendable’ of course. A good example of a Gold Dollar isn’t bad, it’s common, it’s expendable, it’s cheap, and the spine’s too thick anyway. Just as long as you don’t get one ground by Master Shifu after a 3-day bender.

Originally Posted by jaro1069

Yes I have seen them on eBay but those kind of worry me because I like to see "in hand in person" the razor first before buying because the eBay ones I have heard plenty of horror stories of cracked and broken in half and twisted blades

I've always been pleased with my E-Bay purchases; I've gotten some great shavers. Look for reviews of the vendors, and take a close look at the photos.

$30-$40 seems to be the sweet spot for me on the "buy it now." If you spend some time sifting through you can find some great bargains.