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  1. #11
    Senior Member blabbermouth ScoutHikerDad's Avatar
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    In short, hell yes! No doubt you could get a shaving edge off that hard if you know what you're about. Arkies have far more range than most other naturals depending on how the surface is prepped, amount of pressure, honing media (water, soap and water, the various oils, etc.). As others have said, spend a little more and step up to a true hard, surgical black, or translucent, especially since it sounds like you're new to Arkies and may not be able to max out that hard right away.

    As for a good stepping off point, I have done many edges from Nani 12k to Arkie with stellar results. That said, lately I have gotten even better results going from my Norton 8k straight to my 14"x4" Arkie with about a hundred "windshield wiper strokes" on WD-40. But many including me hone on 6x2" (or even 4x1.5 on my old Norton translucent) quite happily and get excellent results.

    There is really nothing quite like a well-done Arkie edge: just exquisitely sharp, precise and smooth. And there are many long threads on this and other fora going into great detail about surface prep (minimal with Dan's stones), various lubes and techniques. Let us know what you end up with, and how it goes!
    There are many roads to sharp.

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    Senior Member blabbermouth outback's Avatar
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    I've too have had good success with soap. Thanks Pete.!

    But I also use it with oil, and glycerin. All depends on how the steel is reacting to the stone. Its a crisp edge that I tame down with a few passes on a web strop, coated with Cr/Ox.

    A translucent is finer yet, Steve. I find the 12k Naniwa, a bit too harsh for me, so a trans would fit your request.

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    Mike

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    Boy Steve you have the hunger for sure. Good for you. If you want a puzzle fall down the ark rabbit hole. There are SSOOOO many variations and so much that can change on surface prep. If you want a "ship in a bottle" project arks are it but boy is it rewarding when you get one tricked out. Arks are about smoothness and/or crispness as Mike said. The most comfortable yet still very keen edge I have been able to produce was with arks. Fortunately and unfortunately both they are slow though so don't.get impatient. If you have the patience and persistence you will be well rewarded by arks.

    Oh yeah, I use water a lot, with or without soap depending but WD-40 also works really well. The list goes on as you will find. One nice thing about them is that they are so dense that the lubricant (whatever kind it is) doesn't soak in and disappear like with the synthetic stones. I know that seems a little high ($-wise) but they are well worth it if you get a good one.
    I'm excited for you Steve. I think you'll really like honing with arks but you have to be willing to put in the time and effort
    Last edited by PaulFLUS; 08-06-2020 at 01:47 AM.
    As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another. PR 27:17

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    Senior Member Brontosaurus's Avatar
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    The stone that the OP posted is not a finisher. "Hard Arkansas" as given is a bit of a misnomer. Actually, it is a soft Arkansas stone. What happened is that the grading system was changed. The older system classified translucents and hard blacks as hard Arkanasas, but now, hard Arkansas dips down into the soft category as well. It's all explained under the Arkansas Stones 101 heading on Dan's website. The actual hard Arkansas stones that are finishers are currently marked as "true hard," "translucent," and "hard black." And as always, the price goes up there.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brontosaurus View Post
    The stone that the OP posted is not a finisher. "Hard Arkansas" as given is a bit of a misnomer. Actually, it is a soft Arkansas stone. What happened is that the grading system was changed. The older system classified translucents and hard blacks as hard Arkanasas, but now, hard Arkansas dips down into the soft category as well. It's all explained under the Arkansas Stones 101 heading on Dan's website. The actual hard Arkansas stones that are finishers are currently marked as "true hard," "translucent," and "hard black." And as always, the price goes up there.
    I'm a bit confused, I am looking at a translucent, 6x2.
    Is it a finisher?

    https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B01...JQHZC6XB&psc=1
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    Before I shell out for a translucent, a questions occured to me.

    I lap my Nortons with the supplied flattening stone.
    I lap my Naniwa 12K ss with wet n dry on a piece of smooth tile
    I have a credit card size diamond hone for making slurry on the nortons.
    I do not have a DMT.

    I assume I would have to lap a translucent.

    How much more do I need to spend to lap it, it will possibly be deal breaker because when I press buy now for the translucent i know I'm going to have instant buyers remorse because I can't really afford it on a whim.

    I know it will be a good investment and my honing journey is demanding me to get it but please tell me that I can lap it for almost free.
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  11. #17
    Senior Member Brontosaurus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by STF View Post
    I'm a bit confused, I am looking at a translucent, 6x2.
    Is it a finisher?

    https://www.amazon.ca/gp/product/B01...JQHZC6XB&psc=1
    Yes, this one as linked is a finisher. The first one as linked, marked "hard Arkansas" on the box, was not.

    As for lapping the Arkansas, there are different schools of thought on this. Dan's stones out of the box are generally pretty flat, so lapping isn't needed to make them flat (which is good as they are quite hard and wear resistant). Some folks will use them as received and let the knives and razors do the smoothing. Others will polish ("burnish" is a term often used) them up to 2000x with silicon carbide abrasives and wet/dry sandpaper seeking a smoothed surface. Others think that stopping at 600x is best as polishing up to 2000x is going too far, etc.

    You can also lap one side of a translucent "rough" and the other side "smooth" for a bit more versatility. Might also be worth picking up a similarly sized soft Arkansas to see how that compares as a natural honing progression.

    Do not use a diamond hone to lap an Arkansas stone as the Arkansas will make short work of the diamond hone's abrasives.
    Last edited by Brontosaurus; 08-06-2020 at 12:35 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by outback View Post
    I've too have had good success with soap. Thanks Pete.!

    But I also use it with oil, and glycerin. All depends on how the steel is reacting to the stone. Its a crisp edge that I tame down with a few passes on a web strop, coated with Cr/Ox.

    A translucent is finer yet, Steve. I find the 12k Naniwa, a bit too harsh for me, so a trans would fit your request.

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    How do you lap it?
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  14. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brontosaurus View Post
    Yes, this one as linked is a finisher. The first one as linked, marked "hard Arkansas" on the box, was not.

    As for lapping the Arkansas, there are different schools of thought on this. Dan's stones out of the box are generally pretty flat, so lapping isn't needed to make them flat (which is good as they are quite hard and wear resistant). Some folks will use them as received and let the knives and razors do the smoothing. Others will polish ("burnish" is a term often used) them up to 2000x with silicon carbide abrasives and wet/dry sandpaper seeking a smoothed surface. Others think that stopping at 600x is best as polishing up to 2000x is going too far, etc.

    You can also lap one side of a translucent "rough" and the other side "smooth" for a bit more versatility. Might also be worth picking up a similarly sized soft Arkansas to see how that compares as a natural honing progression.

    Do not use a diamond hone to lap an Arkansas stone as the Arkansas will make short work of the diamond hone's abrasives.
    Thank you, what do you do, how do you treat yours?
    6 x 2 is a decent size isn't it?
    - - Steve

    You never realize what you have until it's gone -- Toilet paper is a good example

  15. #20
    boz
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    I have several Ark finishers, True hard, Black, Translucent I can't tell the difference in the edge produced they are all excellent edges. My blue black sometimes feels like a superior edge but they are hard to come by.
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