Thread: Naniwa Chosera and Super Stone opinions, please

OK, I'm gonna come clean here.... I sold all my stones except for my DMT's and two coticules. I did it cause the wife said I could buy a Japanese finishing stone if I unloaded everything first, but anyway, the point is, all my Shaptons, Nortons, Spydercos and a few other misc stones.... they're all gone.

And I've been warned by She Who Must Be Obeyed that future raging HAD will not be tolerated.

Rather than dropping a huge amount of coin on a Japanese finisher, I've decided I'm really happy with my current finishing progress, which ends with .1 micron lapping film. So the Japanese finisher is gonna wait for a while.

Instead, I'm planning on replacing the Shapton On Glass set I had. I had the complete set from 1k through and including the 30k. I really enjoyed these stones (more so than the Nortons and Spydercos), but I hated the way they *constantly* needed lapping and refreshing. I also wasn't all that happy with the speed at which they cut. Don't get me wrong, they were good stones, but I think there's gotta be better.

So I've seen a few threads where guys have said some good things about the Naniwas, both the Chosera and the Super Stones.

I'm kinda hoping to get one thread where a bunch of you Naniwa guys can chime in with your likes/dislikes/techniques/suggestions, etc. regarding both the Choseras and Supers.

The Choseras are soooo pricey. Are they really that much better to warrant the extra cash outlay?

For those that are curious, I have managed to successfully replace the entire Shapton set with a 1.2k DMT and two combination BBW/coticules (thanks to Bart's coticule prowess and willingness to share, a guy can go from bevel setting through to finishing polish with a coticule. Just spend some time reading his techniques). I could stay with this setup, really, but I would like to have a complete set once again. Just looking to try something different and/or better than the Shaptons, Nortons and Spydercos.

The coticules will *never* get sold. In fact, over time I can definitely see acquiring more cotis and other naturals, but that's gonna be a bit down the road.

Thanks for any input, gents (and ladies).

Bart has said good things about the Chosera 10K (very sharp edges, good feedback), but he then finished on a hard coticule for smoothness. I think he has the 5K as well.

My experience w/ the supers was that they needed to be lapped frequently as well, not because they dished easily, but because they tended to swell/shrink w/ moisture. After every use, they would need a quick lapping or they wouldn't be totally flat the next time I got them wet. They were fast cutters & could give a nice edge, but they gave me no feedback on how the edge was developing. (They gave a very clear feeling on where the edge was on the stone, which was nice, but not how far from "done" it was.) They certainly did the job and were pretty consistent, but I prefer my coticule doing Bart's "Dilucot" method. Just personal preference here. As always, YMMV.

I've never had the Chosera stones to try but I really like the Naniwa Superstones. I don't mind lapping before each honing session and I find that I don't have to lap as much or as long with the Naniwas as I do with the Shapton Pro stones. AFAIC I'm glad that I got them and use them most of the time unless I am particularly in the mood to hone with something else.

There's talk about the Chosera in this thread.

1000k - Straight Razor Place Forums

I just picked up a complete set of the baseless Choseras, and I can say that they are completely different than the Super Stones (and completely more expensive!) The best part is that there is no sticker on the Choseras!

I've only used them a few times so far, and I find the super stones more "gritty" feeling, but the Choseras almost rubbery, but in a good way...

I really liked them on the couple of carbon razors I did up to 10K so far. I can see myself getting addicted to these, and I am a die-hard Shapton guy!

Originally Posted by PA23-250

Bart has said good things about the Chosera 10K (very sharp edges, good feedback), but he then finished on a hard coticule for smoothness. I think he has the 5K as well.

My experience w/ the supers was that they needed to be lapped frequently as well, not because they dished easily, but because they tended to swell/shrink w/ moisture. After every use, they would need a quick lapping or they wouldn't be totally flat the next time I got them wet. They were fast cutters & could give a nice edge, but they gave me no feedback on how the edge was developing. (They gave a very clear feeling on where the edge was on the stone, which was nice, but not how far from "done" it was.) They certainly did the job and were pretty consistent, but I prefer my coticule doing Bart's "Dilucot" method. Just personal preference here. As always, YMMV.

I'm trying to sell my full set of naniwas i like your self can do all my honing on coticule i use dmt to rebuild bevel or correction if needed to speed things up and go staight to yellow coticule with dilucot method edges are exallant with out the worry of over honing. I like the nortons and also would never sell them . I never got on with naniwas they load up rather quik take ages to dry out i prefer just the one hone or my combo 4k/8k. i never tryed shaptons i never tryed chorsa but i read most people rate the chorsa highly and the shaptons i don't think you will get much better its just personal taste. I started out with nortons i love the norton and belgium coticule because i'm use to them i'm sticking with them and more coticules on the way.

Yeah, I've been using Bart's Unicot and Dilucot methods pretty much exclusively for a few months now, with excellent results. I go from the coti (finishing on the coti with dishwashing liquid/water) to my pastes, to finishing film, then to webbed fabric, then to latigo, and I'm very pleased. The only negative to this process (for me, at least) is the length of time required. My cotis are really slow. Sometimes I just want to get a blade *done*, and want to do it fast.

So I guess what I'm really looking for are good, *fast* stones.

Originally Posted by FloorPizza

So I guess what I'm really looking for are good, *fast* stones.

IMO, Shaptons - hands down.

I'd go for the 500, 1K, 3K, 8K, 16K. The 3k-8k is sweeeeet!

Originally Posted by jendeindustries

IMO, Shaptons - hands down.

I'd go for the 500, 1K, 3K, 8K, 16K. The 3k-8k is sweeeeet!

I would say that you can get the comparable quick and consistent results with Shapton, Naniwa Super and with Norton other than you could use a decent finishing stone after the 8K Norton.

I am not sure how many razors you have honed on what stones, but I can say that I cannot concur with you as a result of honing thousands of razors on each of the stones I mentioned.

Bart's method is also fun to play with on the Coticule, but a lot of times, it takes a lot of playing to get there. I have also used this method on an Escher and Nakayama and although you can still accomplish a one hone result, it really is not the most efficient of methods considering the synthetic stones that are available.

Lynn

I had 1k, 4k, 8k, 16k, and 30k Shapton on Tempered Glass previously, so I'm kinda wanting to try something different. Also off the purchasing list is Norton, King, and Spyderco. I figure I've "been there, done that" with those stones, and would like to try something different.

Right now, the Naniwa Super Stones are in the lead by a nose. They are so much more reasonably priced than either the Shapton on glass or Choseras, I could just about buy the whole line of Super Stones, and still have enough left (compared to buying the whole line of Choseras) to get a moderately priced Japanese finisher.

I read around here somewhere that the Super Stones are what Lynn is currently using to do most of his paid-for honing now days. Anyone know if that's true? It's kinda hard to *not* go with what Lynn uses as his go-to stones, ya know? I noticed he started to carry the Supers at SRD just a few months after I bought my 30k Shapton from him.

Edit: D'oh! I wasn't quick enough.. hit the "submit" button, and I find Lynn just posted minutes ago. "Missed it by THAT much!"

Another Edit: I don't really want to buy cut-in-half Choseras to drop the price, either... I bought a cut-in-half stone once before, and decided that was the last time.