Thread: Buying a Polishing Hone, but which one?

Originally Posted by mainaman

I do not think that is true. I have Asagi that is fine enough to skip the CrO strop, the edge off it is just amazing.

That would make it similar to my "C12k", no need for CrO with that one. :P I'm not against Jnats, I'm sure they do a stellar job, but probably not 300-2000% (or even 10000%) better than a C12k...

Jnats look like infinite fun for people really into honing, experimentation and tradition... at the end of the day a smooth edge is a smooth edge and If I can make it with more $$ in my pockets for soaps, creams and razors, that's even better, IMO.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the OP sounded like he just wanted a good and easy to find & use tool without regard to price (if well justified). I'd have a serious look at a Shapton 30k in that case. (But then 30k will probably be the same as CrO... for 300$ more - 16k would be the better deal and better after a N4k/8k)

Originally Posted by v76

That would make it similar to my "C12k", no need for CrO with that one. :P I'm not against Jnats, I'm sure they do a stellar job, but probably not 300-2000% (or even 10000%) better than a C12k...

Jnats look like infinite fun for people really into honing, experimentation and tradition... at the end of the day a smooth edge is a smooth edge and If I can make it with more $$ in my pockets for soaps, creams and razors, that's even better, IMO.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the OP sounded like he just wanted a good and easy to find & use tool without regard to price (if well justified). I'd have a serious look at a Shapton 30k in that case. (But then 30k will probably be the same as CrO... for 300$ more - 16k would be the better deal and better after a N4k/8k)

if you understand what are you talking about then good luck to You.

Originally Posted by joes978

So my real question is what is the most reliable currently commercially available finishing hone on the market today

Hats off to you sir! This is THE most specific request for hone related advice I have ever seen on these forums. Usually people ask for more info on required use, other hones etc. You have made it easy for someone to help you.
From all of my reading around the forum and distilling the advice of many esteemed members deliverd in simailar threads, I believe there are 2 hones that fit the bill.
The Shapton 16k and the Naniwa 12k. Take your pick.
Personally I have neither of these hones, so hopefully someone more experienced will confirm or refute my recommendation.

Originally Posted by v76

That would make it similar to my "C12k", no need for CrO with that one. :P I'm not against Jnats, I'm sure they do a stellar job, but probably not 300-2000% (or even 10000%) better than a C12k...

Jnats look like infinite fun for people really into honing, experimentation and tradition... at the end of the day a smooth edge is a smooth edge and If I can make it with more $$ in my pockets for soaps, creams and razors, that's even better, IMO.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the OP sounded like he just wanted a good and easy to find & use tool without regard to price (if well justified). I'd have a serious look at a Shapton 30k in that case. (But then 30k will probably be the same as CrO... for 300$ more - 16k would be the better deal and better after a N4k/8k)

You need to try a good Japanese finisher to understand the difference.
I bet there are even finer ones than what I have.
When I talked to So about grit comparison with Shapton 30k , he said that a good Nakayama is finer than that.
As far as the funds, the OP postulated that if money was not an object, what would be a good finishing stone. A quality Jnat finisher can be purchased for a very reasonable amount, the very expensive ones are just very symmetric and big, may be the bigger chunk of the price is based on weight/size

Originally Posted by hi_bud_gl

if you understand what are you talking about then good luck to You.

Tell me more, please! What's unclear? A smooth edge is not just a smooth edge? I'm just saying...

Originally Posted by mainaman

You need to try a good Japanese finisher to understand the difference.
I bet there are even finer ones than what I have.
When I talked to So about grit comparison with Shapton 30k , he said that a good Nakayama is finer than that.
As far as the funds, the OP postulated that if money was not an object, what would be a good finishing stone. A quality Jnat finisher can be purchased for a very reasonable amount, the very expensive ones are just very symmetric and big, may be the bigger chunk of the price is based on weight/size

Thanks for taking the time to give me more info. I'm definitely interested by Jnats and I'm certain that the honing gods cherish them and they have thousands of years of history BUT do you think there's any truth to my statement that for a lesser price you get similar quality and a 8x3 stone that's reliable - same grit throughout (as asked by the OP)... i mean, is there a highly discernable difference between a Shapton 16k or 30k with a Jnat of similar price (but dissimilar size...). I'm just saying...

Yea, just saying.

Originally Posted by v76

Tell me more, please! What's unclear? A smooth edge is not just a smooth edge? I'm just saying...



Thanks for taking the time to give me more info. I'm definitely interested by Jnats and I'm certain that the honing gods cherish them and they have thousands of years of history BUT do you think there's any truth to my statement that for a lesser price you get similar quality and a 8x3 stone that's reliable - same grit throughout (as asked by the OP)... i mean, is there a highly discernable difference between a Shapton 16k or 30k with a Jnat of similar price (but dissimilar size...). I'm just saying...

Yea, just saying.

No I do not

I have had only 16k Shapton, and yes there is huge difference.

As far as 30k Shapton I have not tried it, the person that I talked to deals with stones long enough to know what a natural stone can do and what a synthetic stone can do. I trusted his judgment and got a great stone.
You and anyone else can get w/e stone they want, the question was about advise, and I think advice has been given. The personal choice is left to the individual to make.

Originally Posted by JeffE

Please, there is a very obvious, very easy answer to all of this, and a number of people have hinted around it. Here it is -- ASK ALEX GILMORE OF THE JAPAN BLADE. Alex is a dealer in Japanese natural stones. He sells some less expensive stones on eBay, but the best of his selection are only available through his store. His prices are NOT the lowest out there, but what he offers in return is, to me, infinitely more valuable -- you can actually TRY OUT A FEW STONES and PICK THE ONE YOU LIKE.

I don't know of anyone else dealing stones who is willing to take this kind of time to help you. And for the record, I bought a fantastic stone from him, which gives me a killer edge and is a pleasure to use. It was definitely expensive (around $400), but I felt that it was money well spent because it was a stone that I got to try out and experiment with before buying.

By the way, I also have a really nice Belgian combo coticule, and I don't think the coticule and the Japanese stone really compare. The coticule is very, very fine and gives a great polish, but to my inexperienced eye, it looks like the coticule removes a LOT of metal compared to the Japanese stone. The Japanese stone really takes away very little metal with each stroke and leaves your razor super scary sharp. I don't think there's anything like it in the sharpening world.

Anyway, you get the drift. Call Alex, and tell him that I (and others) recommended him. He's the guy you want.

1+... Me too.... I just completed the purchase of a stone from Alex a couple of weeks ago. He spent a great deal of time with me on the phone and wanted to know exactly what I was looking for. He hand picked some stones and I sent him a deposit. He sent me 4 stones to try and I spent several weeks deciding exactly what was best for me. When I was done, I sent the stones back and he refunded my balance of the deposit. Was a truly enjoyable transaction and perfect customer service. I ended up buying this stone.....

SUITA_207

I haven't had enough time to spend with it yet but it won't be a stone I will outgrow and should last my lifetime. I also won't have to spend twice that on 5 other stones looking for what I want and still not find it..... Better to get the best and not regret it.

Just my thoughts and experience.....

Barry

Originally Posted by mainaman

You and anyone else can get w/e stone they want, the question was about advise, and I think advice has been given. The personal choice is left to the individual to make.

Well..., you sparked a discussion by saying my advice was wrong. Anyway. I'll leave it at that.

The the OP: Zowada Custom Knives - Razor Edges

I own an 8x3 combination coticule, and a Japanese stone that's named 'My Precious' which was done in all seriousness.

They are both elegantly wonderful and not for sale. I wouldn't know how to assure you of such quality, I spent money and got lucky both. Twice.

My best source is currently out and waiting hopefully, on the large belgians, but medium sized may exist. On reliability and speed, a combo belgian isn't arguable, much more likely to be pleased than with the same dollar number spent on japanese.

unfortunately with the strength of the yen, stones aren't cheap one bit, in dollars. Almost 50% increase in a few years on currency rates alone. So a fine japanese hone must wait on the magic intersection of luck and money, hurrying not useful.

Get the best belgian you can find. The Japanese stone, plan on chasing very Gently.

Ok, even though I asked about readily commercially available stones, the information I got back from Alex at thejapanblade.com was unbelievably detailed. I was getting little information about other stones from retailers. I understand that natural stones are always a risk, but for the price the stone is worth the risk. If anyone is looking for a Japanese natural hone, Alex is your guy. When I get the stone I'll post a review. Thanks to everyone for the advice.