Thread: The first hone...

Hi everyone. So, I've been at straight razor shaving for a good two months or so now (thanks to all the guidance I've gotten from you guys) and I've been thinking about learning to hone ever since.

I've already got a few of the basics, a recently obtained DMT D8C for lapping and working on knives in bad condition, a King 1k I had previous to starting with straights (I work as a cook, I use it for my knives as well) and a C12k which I picked up early on for touch ups and the like. Well, I'm sure you all can see whats missing here! I've finally got the funds to pick up a good mid range, workhouse hone and I'm quite stuck as what to get.

I know the Norton 4k/8k is the standard suggestion with Naniwa's coming in second. Of the two it sounds like the Naniwa's are a good starter choice as well as maybe giving you a little more hone for your buck (less likely to wear through, from my understanding.)

However, I've really found myself drawn to the Coti's or Coti/BBW's. I like the idea of a natural hone, I like the fact that its a single hone that can be used start to finish, I like the fact that it will wear much slower and I like that I can potentially use them to sharpen my knives as well (from my understanding at least, and it always makes the expense easier to justify if I can tie it into work! ) In other words, I'm okay with spending a little more for something of higher quality, and more utility.

What do you guys think? Is it possible to learn on a Coti? I've got a few razors to ruin and lots of time, so thats not a problem. Have any of you started with a coti, or do you have any input here? Thanks in advance!

You can learn on a coti/bbw (I did, actually), but it is not the easiest way. I don't know anything about knives, but I would think you should be able to hone them on a Norton - Nani's are soft so I'd be worried, but I would assume they were not created for razors so they must be ok for tools/knives. As for wearing through a hone - it takes mant thousands of honings to wear one out, so anything should last decades it not a lifetime (unless you do Ltnn-like volume). I would think a hone you need to slurry on (bbw and/or coti - depending how you use them) would wear faster than a non-slurry-needing hone, but again, decades if not lifetimes.

Really, you can do all the research and ask all the questions, but only you can decide. And if you find you decided wrong, you can always rebuy (and sell, if needs be), so there is no wrong decision (unless you buy garbage).

Thanks for the point about wear. I guess I'm just used to the kind of wear you see with the lower grit stones and knives. A co-worker of mine left his hone at work once- it was down to nothing in a month (admittedly we do have an over-zealous sharpener or two, but still!)

I guess mainly I wanted to know if starting with the Coti/BBW is advisable (or even sane) I'm willing to put in the effort to learn, but I just want to make sure I'm not wasting time and energy before I throw down the green for a fancy Coti or combo. Thanks for the input though.

By the way, whats the recommended source for these? I know of Ardennes and I know SRD and other shaving sites sell them. I know theres also a lot of to-do about various veins or grades of these stones. This is also a little troubling for me and is keeping me from jumping right in a picking one up.

Thanks again

You can do it, but I wouldn't recommend it because, to me, learning the easy way with the least variables makes the msot sense. Don't ask why I didn't heed my own advice...

I donwt know too much about coti's, I got mine on the classifieds and don't know its vein or grade. From my reading and limited understanding/experience, I think that any one that is suitable for razors will do the trick, but a knowledgable vendor/member may be able to hand select a fast cutter or fine finisher or hard one or etc etc. I don't know how significant the differences are. though.

you can do knives on coticule, but Naniwa is better, that is the perfect excuse to get both ?

The norton 4/8 would be my recommendation. Down the road if you stick with it a coti combo would be a nice addition for your razors but start with the workhorse and get the thoroughbred after you know how to ride.

Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

The norton 4/8 would be my recommendation. Down the road if you stick with it a coti combo would be a nice addition for your razors but start with the workhorse and get the thoroughbred after you know how to ride.

I'm sure this is very sound advice, as I've seen it repeated many times already. My only problem with this though is that I don't want to buy what is essentially the same tool twice (serving the same purpose and all.) Norton's are cheaper but they still certainly aren't cheap! I'd much rather spend a little more at first and have something I'll be happy with for a long time to come, as opposed to 'working my way up' to other hones and another large investment.

I'll have to think on it some more I guess. I think I may have just got myself stuck on the idea of a coti and all its hype. By the way, side question... Would the coti be used as the finisher or would my C12k be a suitable follow up? I know it would be for the other stones but I hear many people like the finish off the coti... I think... do people generally follow it with a finisher?

There just stones. Do whatever you'd like. Don't ask about finishing. Do it and see for yourself.

I can finish and shave off a brick, that hardly helps you and your quest.

Think of it this way, artists really don't focus too much on what brush they use. You don't see an apprentice artist asking which brush would be best to become an artist.

Originally Posted by AFDavis11

There just stones. Do whatever you'd like. Don't ask about finishing. Do it and see for yourself.

I can finish and shave off a brick, that hardly helps you and your quest.

Think of it this way, artists really don't focus too much on what brush they use. You don't see an apprentice artist asking which brush would be best to become an artist.

Brick?
Tell us more..

There are more naturals you can choose from but the Coticule is definately one of the best for it's range. You should be able to get a good or decent shave from using the Coticule as finisher but if you follow it with the C12k/Guangxi you will get a keener edge and a better shave imo.

Going from 1k to a BBW or Coticule is a big leap. Using slurry could bridge that gap or you could add a 3-4k waterstone.