Thread: which stones to buy?

Which stones to buy.

This is all my personal experience. Some of you will be agree some wont. I would be gladly read every single honest critics remarks and i deeply appreciate.
I will start from Newbies and move on forward.
As of today there is couple synthetic brand stones available.
shaptons,Nani was,Norton.
Norton is 1k.4/8k. shapton and Naniwas do have many more different grits available.
In my Experience i have used shapton and Nortons.
i have seen a lot people happy with their Naniwas.
compare this 2 brands shapton and Norton i would recommend Norton for starters.
The reason Very easy to learn and price is chipper then compare rest 2 brands.
You will need to have Norton 1k for setting bevel ,taking out chips. and 4/8 finishing the edge.Can you get comfortable shave off 8k i should say yes you can.
Now Most likely you will end up chro2 paddle strop if that is the only hones you have.nortons)
About shaptons.
They have a lot more grits available 500--------30.000
Never used 30.k and no idea how it does work.
Shapton 1k very easy to use stone but it is not as fast cutter as norton 1k(in fact shapton 1k in fact isn't 1k real time)
that is why if you have chips to remove better will be to use Norton.
Many people ends up buying shaptons and 16k is the most used one. (most likely because of price)
I would discourage anyone to use 16 k shapton as a finishing stone.
My reason for it this. straight razor edge get so fine when you use 16 as a finisher it brakes down the edge. as a result you will have harsh shaving feelings.
30k i have no idea.
Naniwa 12 k i have not used . I have seen Lynn used and i have observe the edge.
I should say i liked so much. Again do understand next words they are not mine. Lynn after finishing on 12k did you paddle strop with paste and edge was shave ready.
Now about more confusing stage . Natural stones.

there is a lot issues in here.
first and most important how much money yuo would like to spend.
natural stones which i have used are
Coticule, Japanese stones. Nakayama An Escher.

At first i should say.
Not all Natural stones same.

Japanese stones has so many names and mines . if you are going to buy Japanese Stone you need to (must) have someone guide you.
They are expensive and if you don't get what you want you are loosing a lot money.
In the other hand if you could get the stone mean to for straight razor Japanese stone will make you very happy.
i should say child can use them.
Please do understand. It is not easy to find stone which will suite for your straight razors.
Now about coticules.
So far i have own more then 130 Coticules. They are different 1 from another so much you will need help on this too.
i have seen coticule will cut as fast as 4k Norton and sound like sand while you hone. Edge will be in 4 k level too.
i have seen coticue will cut fast and edge will be 8k level.
i do own 1 coticule very very slow cutter and friend of mine calls ITALIAN mramir In fact i think that is the best Coticule i have.Edge will come out from that stone very close to escher edge. Not same.
To use coticule you need to have experience or learn how to use it. they have garnets etc. make slurry and dilute slowly until you get clean water you will get better result.
Lastly An Eschers.
They have different colors. dark blue -------light.yellow green. Some people will say their finest depends on colors.
I am not sure about it.
i do have black color droeschr and escher they will both perform same as light/yellow green level.
In My opinion there is not so much differences among Escher 's edge. they are similar.
Edge comes out of escher i think is the best . But you need to know how to use it.
i wuold say escher is not sharpening stone . it is final touching up stone. if you use right time you will love it . wrong time you will hate it.
To spend money to buy which one of natural stones?
i would advise go with escher.(price and quality)
hope all this helps. gl.

Great post Sham. In another thread holli4 pointed out that norton, shapton, naniwa will all get you there if you know what you're doing and I agree with that. I would recommend the naniwa because that series is my current favorite. OTOH, the nortons would be less expensive and the shaptons are very good too. I have no experience with the glass stones (shaptons) but the 15k pro is really good IME. I just like the feel of the edge off of the naniwa 12k better.

As for naturals, I love the resulting edge from an Escher. I've also gotten similar edges from a couple of Hohenzollerns I have. I haven't had as many coticules as you but I do have 18 at present. They seem to be like potato chips, I can't have just one. I like the edge I get off of them but on my particular mug they aren't quite up to the refinement I get from the Escher. I know others will disagree but that is why God made apples and oranges.

There are different approaches to straight razors and honing them. Some , probably the majority, will get a set of stones and be satisfied with them and never look back. Others, like Sham and myself, keep looking for that perfect stone that will produce the ultimate edge.

I find honing to be a journey where I am testing the qualities of the stone, the razor and my honing skill. There are so many variables and that is what makes it so interesting to me. It never ends ..... until it does and then I'll go to that big razor forum in the sky .... I hope.

I started with Naniwa stones, because I had them already when I got my first straight.
I used a mixed progression of Naniwa Chosera and Superstones, they are made of the same abrasive so the consistency in my opinion is preserved.
I finish on Nakayama Asagi and I like the results very much.

My progression used to consist of 1.3.5.8.10k synthetic and Asagi, but I wanted to cut down on the number of stones involved so I got Yanoshigima Suita to bridge 3k to Asagi, and the stone works superbly well.
Based on my experience so far, I prefer natural stones over synthetic , both because of better finish and fewer stones that I use.
I am very interested in trying other natural stones too.

A piece of advise to those that are looking for a Japanese natural stone, make sure to buy for a reputable seller with a lot of experience with stones. You will get the most for your money, and not waste funds on expensive but useless for you stone.

A very informative post Thankyou !



ian

Originally Posted by mainaman

I started with Naniwa stones, because I had them already when I got my first straight.
I used a mixed progression of Naniwa Chosera and Superstones, they are made of the same abrasive so the consistency in my opinion is preserved.
I finish on Nakayama Asagi and I like the results very much.

My progression used to consist of 1.3.5.8.10k synthetic and Asagi, but I wanted to cut down on the number of stones involved so I got Yanoshigima Suita to bridge 3k to Asagi, and the stone works superbly well.
Based on my experience so far, I prefer natural stones over synthetic , both because of better finish and fewer stones that I use.
I am very interested in trying other natural stones too.

A piece of advise to those that are looking for a Japanese natural stone, make sure to buy for a reputable seller with a lot of experience with stones. You will get the most for your money, and not waste funds on expensive but useless for you stone.

I was about to specifically ask whether one could mix stone types in the overall honing process. I've got a set of 5, 8, 12 on the way, but need a 1K and wondered whether deviating from the medium/method for the 1K would create problems.

Originally Posted by BobKincaid

I was about to specifically ask whether one could mix stone types in the overall honing process. I've got a set of 5, 8, 12 on the way, but need a 1K and wondered whether deviating from the medium/method for the 1K would create problems.

In my opinion it will not matter at all, bevel setter is a bevel setter by the time you get to your 12k the 1k scratches will be long gone. One thing you need to consider is how fast the stone is, and then there is the personal preference of which stone feels best to your liking. The most important stone in the set up is the finisher.

I mix up my hones. I use a Norton 1k because it is a fast and aggressive bevel setter. I then go to a Naniwa 5k and 8k, which I love because they are fast and really smooth out the edge. Then I finish on my Asagi because I love the cutting speed and the feedback it gives.

Originally Posted by mainaman

In my opinion it will not matter at all, bevel setter is a bevel setter by the time you get to your 12k the 1k scratches will be long gone. One thing you need to consider is how fast the stone is, and then there is the personal preference of which stone feels best to your liking. The most important stone in the set up is the finisher.

Being way more of a Restorer than a Honemeister I would beg to differ

I never do more than 20 laps on my finishers no mater the type...

I might grow almost intimate with my bevel setter as I correct years of bad honing, multiple bevels, or damage on a blade...
The finisher has no use, if the bevel wasn't set right first

I actually did a thread on this at one time about how every single person always says the establishing the bevel is the most important part of honing a razor, but we all only brag about how great our finishers are, and then argue between each other which is best... it is all about the bevel baby hehehe

Himmmmmmmmm
This is catch 22 Glen.
if you wont set the bevel you wont get the final edge right.
if you will not finish the edge then your blade will shave crappy. End result is same.
gl

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Being way more of a Restorer than a Honemeister I would beg to differ

I never do more than 20 laps on my finishers no mater the type...

I might grow almost intimate with my bevel setter as I correct years of bad honing, multiple bevels, or damage on a blade...
The finisher has no use, if the bevel wasn't set right first

I actually did a thread on this at one time about how every single person always says the establishing the bevel is the most important part of honing a razor, but we all only brag about how great our finishers are, and then argue between each other which is best... it is all about the bevel baby hehehe

I actually use my Naniwa Super and Chosera 1K the most for bevel setting. If I am doing some restoration, I will drop down to the 220 Naniwa super and then use tape. That said, if I need more abrasion, I will use the Norton 220 or 1K. I normally do not tape with the 1K, but will with the Norton because it eats up spines. Without a properly set bevel, you are heading into a world of frustration and a lot more honing than a razor will normally need to endure. By the way, I also restore a ton of blades and right here is where the rubber meets to road to bringing them back to shavability, especially when coming off the buffers.........

From the bevel set or 1K, I normally use either Naniwa Supers or the Norton 4K/8K combo followed by either Naniwa Super 12K, Escher or Asagi. I don't like to have to do more than 10 strokes on a finishing stone and find that the stones mentioned are the most reliable and consistent out there. The Shapton on Glass can be used interchangeably here too. I almost always follow the finisher with .5 diamond spray on felt too, but that is just my preference. Yeah, there are a lot of other hones out there and I have tried almost all of them. These mentioned have been the most successful as I continue on this journey of education.

Have fun,

Lynn