Thread: Tomonagura confusion

Originally Posted by boshane

...can I deduce that...

Originally Posted by mainaman

unless the slurry colors are different how can you tell which stone makes the slurry?

I can't... Which is why I was hoping that someone with much more experience could chime in with a similar situation they had experienced and give a possible answer.

Originally Posted by mainaman

You say you get great edges using your hard tomonagura, why would you want to change?

Well, if it is in fact the harder tomonagura that is raising a slurry off of my Oozuko, and if it is possible to get the same consistency of slurry with a DMT or something similar, then avoiding using a tiny piece of stone to do it would be ideal.

Originally Posted by boshane

I can't... Which is why I was hoping that someone with much more experience could chime in with a similar situation they had experienced and give a possible answer.

there is no absolute test to be able to tell which is harder, you can do the drop test and compare but it is not 100% accurate.
One other indication would be if your base stone does not get scratched by the tomonagura then it is the harder of the two.

Well, if it is in fact the harder tomonagura that is raising a slurry off of my Oozuko, and if it is possible to get the same consistency of slurry with a DMT or something similar, then avoiding using a tiny piece of stone to do it would be ideal.

you want your base stone to be as smooth as possible and this will not happen when you use DMT.

Cool, thanks! I'll stick with my tomonagura then

i know diamond plates as coarse as 1200 are commonly used these days for raising slurry on jnats, and i've heard folks saying that diamond plates will even break down the slurry somewhat, but my intuition without any experience is that a diamond plate such as that would actually produces a coarser slurry.. does anyone else think this way? would it even matter if it were so? does anyone reject using diamond plates over a proper tomonagura?

Sorry to revive an old thread here… but I’m having some problems with my tomonagura scratching my stone (lvl 5+, came from maxsim as a pair). I lapped both up to 400 grit sandpaper, but when I use the tomo, whether wet or dry, it puts deep scratches in the stone (and less deep scratches in the tomo). I’m assuming that means the tomo is harder than the base stone, but does that mean I can’t use them together? Or is there an issue with technique maybe?

Also, I’m getting tired of lapping these scratches out… what’s the best aproach? Do you go back to the 400 or should I drop to 220?

Try a reverse method

Shhhhhh it's a secret

Take the Nagura, rub it on your plate and make a slurry, flip the plate over, and rub it and the slurry on the stone

Try that, there are no absolutes with naturals but if it works for you like it does for me when I use a Kita Nagura with my stone, make sure you keep it a secret

Didn’t have my glasses on, thought you said “pate” for a second, thought “well yeah I’d better keep that secret if I try it…”

Makes well enough sense. I’m using sandpaper, not a plate, but seems like it’d be the same, no? I’ll give it a shot, thanks.

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Try a reverse method

Shhhhhh it's a secret

Take the Nagura, rub it on your plate and make a slurry, flip the plate over, and rub it and the slurry on the stone

Try that, there are no absolutes with naturals but if it works for you like it does for me when I use a Kita Nagura with my stone, make sure you keep it a secret

There are techniques for creating slurries without scratching the base stone.

Round an edge on the Tomo is one way. If the Tomo is flat try slightly raising one side, is another.

However if it is just a super hard, non compliant Tomo then try as stated above, the Tomo slurry transfer technique

Personally i would leave the scratches alone, they will disappear with time and aren't worth lapping away your lovely stone.

Be gentle with the Tomo , if you hear or feel a scratch, stop and re evaluate..

///
Sandpaper could leave glass pieces in your stones after lapping.. Just a thought.

“I’m using sandpaper, not a plate, but seems like it’d be the same, no?”

No.

Sand paper can release grit (silicon carbide), is not friable, (will not break down) especially if it is not quality paper. You get what you pay for in high grit Wet or Dry sand paper. One single loose silicone carbide grit can imbed in a soft stone, especially if the paper was folded or torn.

You can buy a good Diamond plate from Chefs Knives to Go for $35 or small Credit card plates for 10-15.

If you have a sharp corner you may be breaking off larger pieces. Round off all sharp corners of the nagura on a Diamond plate.

So, there are 2 schools, one that fine or worn diamond plates create slurry at about the size of the diamonds (300-1k) and the slurry will break down further polishing the razor and the stone as you hone. You have to work the slurry longer to break it down.

Or you polish the stone with a softer Nagura, and as it polishes the stone it leaves a fine slurry on a smooth stone. Now you are polishing the razor on a smooth stone with a fine slurry.

With all Naturals you have to experiment and find a system that works for you with the tools and stones you have.

First, invest in a diamond plate, it is a life time purchase.

Originally Posted by JOB15

There are techniques for creating slurries without scratching the base stone.

Round an edge on the Tomo is one way. If the Tomo is flat try slightly raising one side, is another.

However if it is just a super hard, non compliant Tomo then try as stated above, the Tomo slurry transfer technique

Personally i would leave the scratches alone, they will disappear with time and aren't worth lapping away your lovely stone.

Be gentle with the Tomo , if you hear or feel a scratch, stop and re evaluate..

///
Sandpaper could leave glass pieces in your stones after lapping.. Just a thought.

I rounded the corners and beveled the edges. Would raising one side just reduce the surface area and thus the chances of it sticking/catching?

I’ve read both that the scratches can be left and that they can’t (including earlier in this thread). Not sure which guidance to follow or what the reasoning is behind either, other than thatthe scratches go inward and so wouldn’t/might not touch the edge.

Is there any way to check if sandpaper is leaving glass? I think I also read diamond plates could leave diamonds in the surface… is there any other way that won’t introduce unwanted foreign material?

Thanks!