Thread: Newbie - is this hone sufficient?

Picked it up at a knife store. Dual sided/dual grit, but I'm not sure what the actual grit rating is...

It's from dan's whetstone company, the two sides are hard Arkansas and soft Arkansas according to the paper that came with it.

In the pic you can already see the gunk from my attempts at honing...which brings up another question - is the gunk bad?

Thanks!!
Geoff

I'm sure it's fine for knives. I would not use it for a razor.
You are much better off buying somethign known good for razors, like a 4/8k Norton.

Geoff,
I would not recommend that stone for a razor. Waterstones like the Norton, Naniwa, or Shapton's from 1K-8K are what is recommended. Some of us go up to 30K.

I'm not sure what your knowledge base is, but I would recommend that you get the shaving down first with a known shave ready razor. Once you have it down, then delve into maintaining that razor with the stones. Once you get that down, sure, jump in and try honing out.
All the best,
Scott

Thanks guys. I've got a newly honed razor coming back to me in mail from another forum member (roughkype) maybe today even, so soon enough I should know what a proper blade feels like. :-)

I'll reserve this one for my kitchen knives then :-)

Any particular recommendations for a first hone? Sounds like maybe the Norton 4k/8k is the place to start? I do have a second razor (Sheffield frameback) that I'd like to try and get sharp if possible.

Thanks!
Geoff

Yeah, the Norton 4/8 is a great setup.
Another fine option would be a 3/8 Naniwa superstone combo.
Both very good, and not all that expensive either

Hey Geoff,

+1 to the Norton or Naniwa combo. Your setup should also include a way to lap the hone surfaces flat--could just be wet/dry sandpaper on your kitchen counter, but the standard tool is a DMT 325 plate. Some folks say your flattening plate must be at least as big as your hones, but I've got the 6x2 version and it's fine. You can also get flattening stones, but they in turn must be flattened. DMT is a better solution. And weird but true, even a brand-new hone must be flattened.

If you're going to hone razors from E-bay, you'll also need a ~1000 grit hone. I'd advise against a DMT for this; they don't release their grit, so can tear up the blade a little (at a microscopic level, anyway). Waterstone grit particles come loose from the matrix when they're too dull to cut any more, or when the blade snags them funny, and they also tend to be a little rounder than the diamonds on the DMTs. For these reasons, they leave a smoother edge and shallower scratches, which are easier to polish out at the next grit level.

Once you can create a good shaving edge from the 8k, you're a pretty good honer and ready to move onto something like a Naniwa12k. Ooooh nice! But if you're not getting a shaving edge from the 8k, the 12k won't do anything but polish the ridges between your 8k scratches.

A good 10x magnifier (a Coddington or a Hastings Triplet) is a great help, as you can see the scratch patterns and monitor your progress.

Here's more about hones from our Wiki, and also a very good overview for folks wanting to start honing.

If you can't afford the right tools this week, pinch your pennies until you can. They're the best to learn on, to use, and the easiest to resell if you change your mind or want to fund some fancier ones down the road.

Your best bet for finding an off-the-shelf 4k/8k or 3k/8k hone is probably a fine woodworking store. Other than that, mail order is solution.

Good luck! Glad to see you're acting on your enthusiasm.

The gunk's not bad, probably. It's swarf, metal particles. Water or oil on the hone helps keep the swarf from clogging the grit.

Sheffield steel leaves marks like that much more than German or American steel, because it's a little softer. Sometimes if I hit a pit on a Sheffield blade it disgorges a tiny spot of oxidized crud that smears around like a razor booger on the hone.

One nice progress measure on the 4k/8k hone is that if your first strokes on the 8k side leave swarf, it means you weren't done on the 4k side. Go back for more laps at 4k, then back to the 8k and see if your laps are clean. If so, proceed on the 8.

You can pick a 4000 and 8000 k King for cheaper.

Good info, thanks!!! I knew nothing about flattening the surface of your hone and didn't even know it was necessary.

I'll see how much I can get away with using sandpaper to start; i don't have delusions of grandeur about becoming a honemeister, (too many other things I want to be a meister at!) but i would like to be self-sufficient and be able to take care of my own blades.

PS these things get expensive! Any leads on finding them a little more affordably? I think the best price I saw for the norton 4/8 just now was $75. Is that reasonable?

Originally Posted by gdgross

I think the best price I saw for the norton 4/8 just now was $75. Is that reasonable?

Meh, it depends. Unless a kind soul helps you out on a sale, that's probably what they'll go for if you look around. If you need any justification, just consider that you can sharpen other knives on it and through normal use it will last you years if not decades if not more.

If you decide that you really don't like it you shouldn't lose too much money on a resale, IMO.