Thread: A magnified comparison of many honing results

Below is a comparison of how many of the most well known stones perform on the same blade. I found this helpful and wanted to share it. Maybe foster some friendly debate. This is where I found the info Zowada Custom Knives - Razor Edges

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This is a quick study I put together while I am learning how to hone razors on a semi-production basis. This is not meant to be a definitive study of the honing qualities of various stones. Rather, it is just meant to give me a basic idea of what's going on.

The stone surfaces, and the razor edges are all at 200x.
The razor is O1/L6 Damascus at 62.5 HRC.
The initial edge is honed at a 15 degree included angle.
The initial edge was a horizontal, along the edge, scratch pattern developed with a Norton 8000 grit hone.
Ten, 5" long" strokes were used on each side of the blade.
Only the weight of the blade was used for pressure.
No stropping was done after honing.
All stones, except Spyderco, were used wet.
No slurry was used on any stone.
All stones were freshly lapped at 2000 grit.

The lapped edges had a Chinese 12000 grit finish for the final honing step.

Here, the edge is viewed at a 52 degree angle. This gives a better idea of how the actual cutting edge looks.

Procedure

1. Hone blade at 15 degrees with Norton 8000.
Hone marks should be at least 0 - 40 degrees relative to edge.

2. Add one layer of 0.006" electrical tape to blade back
This kicks the angle up to 15.75 degrees and gives the test stone a fresh edge to work on.

3. Use ten strokes, 5" long, alternating blade sides.

4. Clean edge with acetone.

5. Photograph under microscope.
The blade was held in place with clay and pushed agianst a 60 degree reference.


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Yellow/Green Escher
Bue/Green Escher

Cro2 10 passescro2 5 passesNorton 8 K Swaty

Here are a few more. Chinese 12 K OhiraSpyderco UF Thuringen

Dude, bad A** stuff... I know it's been around for a while, as Zowada is well known. However, I've never seen them myself, but had been told, so thanks for sharing them.

Amazing how the C12k does so well, eh? I never knew... Also the swaty, surpriiiiiiiiisssssssseeeee!!!! A lot rougher than I imagined. However, I have 4 Swaty's that are all different, and he doesn't say here what age the swaty is (3 line, etc.) as I have an old 3 line that is hard as hell. I know it polishes better than the one in that picture, I've looked at it myself under 30x, not as good as above, but still visible. So, I'm kind of shocked at that pic... Live and learn.

Thanks again bro,

Mike

Yes, I am new to this stuff and I found it fascinating and literally "eye opening". I will be more aware during future shopping trips.

Nice!!! This save me from having to buy a microscope and all the time to try this myself.

Looks like I'll keep my C12k and just add a little Cro2.

One last thought. What would it look like after a short ride on a 30k?

Originally Posted by mjhammer

Dude, bad A** stuff... I know it's been around for a while, as Zowada is well known. However, I've never seen them myself, but had been told, so thanks for sharing them.

Amazing how the C12k does so well, eh? I never knew... Also the swaty, surpriiiiiiiiisssssssseeeee!!!! A lot rougher than I imagined. However, I have 4 Swaty's that are all different, and he doesn't say here what age the swaty is (3 line, etc.) as I have an old 3 line that is hard as hell. I know it polishes better than the one in that picture, I've looked at it myself under 30x, not as good as above, but still visible. So, I'm kind of shocked at that pic... Live and learn.

Thanks again bro,

Mike

you need to take into account the angle at which the pic is taken, that changes what you see, i.e scratches on the bevel, dramatically.

Ahh well this explains my recent failures in shaving. I was going off the pic at coticule.be. It shows a pretty visible scratch pattern. I kinda always thought when people said "mirror", they were just embellishing for the sake of clarity. Apparently, it really is a mirror finish. Geez, don't I feel silly. Back to the hones I go.

Ummmm

Ok a few things here

1. Did you ask Tim to use his Pics??? (That I am asking as an SRP Mod)
2. The scratch pattern means nothing to the shaving comfort
3. Note the Pasted strop pics
4. The sides of the bevel are only a very small part of the equation
5. Once you strop on linen and leather all this changes
6. All these pics are great, but they are not acurate portrayals of what you should expect on your face..

Be very very careful when you try to make correlations with microscopic pics of the bevel, and how good a stone is for actual shaving


Think of this about the same way you look at the pretty radar pics on the evening weather, they showing something , but only walking outside will tell you what is really going on

Originally Posted by Str8RazorSerg

Boo!! Can we give a thumbs-down to comments??

The guy is only expressing an observation. Never did he state that his observation is a direct correlation with quality of shave/hone. Let the man share his observation.

But as #1 in gssixguns post states these aren't really HIS observations! they are pictures from a different web site that the OP has linked to but before I clicked on the link (which I did AFTER seeing gs's post FWIW) I assumed the pictures were the OPs and and the link was to HIS web site including the same information of HIS findings.

I think also what is being said is that while looking at a magnified edge/bevle is all well and good you never really know how or how well a stone performs until you put the steal to the skin! So use the photos not to judge how well a stone has done at honing but if you are on the right track and done have burr's and other anomalies. (glen please correct me if I am wrong/misinterpreted your post)

Originally Posted by BenjamanBarker

But as #1 in gssixguns post states these aren't really HIS observations! they are pictures from a different web site that the OP has linked to but before I clicked on the link (which I did AFTER seeing gs's post FWIW) I assumed the pictures were the OPs and and the link was to HIS web site including the same information of HIS findings.

I think also what is being said is that while looking at a magnified edge/bevle is all well and good you never really know how or how well a stone performs until you put the steal to the skin! So use the photos not to judge how well a stone has done at honing but if you are on the right track and done have burr's and other anomalies. (glen please correct me if I am wrong/misinterpreted your post)

An observation is an observation, regardless of where it was observed from. I agree that it doesn't mean squat until proven by putting steel-to-face, so it's a given that people should take it for what it's worth. I think the OP was just sharing what he found...nothing more.