Thread: The value of mentorship in learning to hone - Part II

Spent another morning with friend and honing mentor, mjsorkin (Michael).

Huge thanks to Michael, and his family, for welcoming my into their home to share this time.

I had learned a ton in our first honing session, simply by watching Michael hone. Online videos are nice, and certainly help, but being close-up and personal, being able to ask questions on the fly, seeing and hearing the action up close makes for a tremendous advancement in the learning curve.

This time, we changed roles. I honed while Michael watched. I suspect this proved to be most advantageous. Michael spotted a few things I could do to improve...

• When the razor hits the stone... it hits spine first!! I really need to work on this;
• My circles were far too abbreviated. I am now focusing on true circles. In most of the video's I have seen, the camera can't keep up with the strokes being made and circles often look like half strokes;
• My blade pressure & contact needs work. My muscle memory isn't set yet and my pressure differs on the away and return strokes. Only way I can perfect this is with practice, so I left with the homework assignment to do at least 300 x-strokes over a few sessions to set the muscle memory. I also asked Michael to again show me the different pressure levels we are using... That's something you simply can't pick up in a video. Michael used the spine of the razor against my palm to show me how much pressure I should be using. We also identified points where I am lift toe or heel;
• I was surprised at how few strokes were required on the Norton 4/8. I'll admit, I was beating my blades into submission with the 'More is Better' attitude.. We fixed that;
• We also focused on the [seemingly controversial] idea of trying to force edge tests to fail, rather than force them to pass. It's a philosophical statement that you either get or you don't.. But for me, it's one of those light bulbs going off. When are you REALLY ready to move on to the next step in the honing progression? False positives appear all over. Cross-test where you are before moving on. It could save a ton of time;
• I learned I need [want] a Chosera 1k instead of my King 1k. I ordered it yesterday. The 'action' of the Chosera just feels better than the King. I am at a loss to explain it much better than that;
• Patience. Be slow and deliberate.

We both had a few bouts of coveting the others gear... It seemed to go like this each time..

Person A - 'If you ever decide to sell that... let me know!! I want!! '
Person B - ' Um.. yeah.. that ain't gonna happen...'

(We discovered we are both waiting on delivery of Ralf Aust 7/8's.. Razor Brothers! Happy New Year!)

Spending time one-on-one, as I have been fortunate to do with Michael, has no doubt accelerated my learning curve. Some facets I may never have gotten had I not seen, heard, felt in person...

Michael, you are a gentleman. A wonderful, patient teacher. Thank you!

Glad to hear of your progress and thanks for the tips.

At our Long Island get-together Michael was extremely patient with this novice.

I did not attempt any honing at the time but advice on blades, edges and stropping were more than useful. I can now shave very well with the straaights and maintain my edges (minus stones) so I'm ready for the next step.

Michael is one of the reasons this site is so good.

Originally Posted by GC7

Glad to hear of your progress and thanks for the tips.

At our Long Island get-together Michael was extremely patient with this novice.

I did not attempt any honing at the time but advice on blades, edges and stropping were more than useful. I can now shave very well with the straaights and maintain my edges (minus stones) so I'm ready for the next step.

Michael is one of the reasons this site is so good.

Agreed!

And thanks for sharing that!! Sadly, I had missed the LI meet-up.

There are a few points that might be useful to the masses. The rest is just me sharing a good experience... as always, YMMV!!

The value of face to face across the table time cannot be over exaggerated, and although it is a great learning experience for the novice honer, those doing the teaching also learn quite a bit too...

Originally Posted by gssixgun

The value of face to face across the table time cannot be over exaggerated, and although it is a great learning experience for the novice honer, those doing the teaching also learn quite a bit too...

No doubt..

I teach photography to some pretty talented clubs and individuals. I learn something new every time I present or teach. Whether it's a new way to communicate something, working through a unique problem or coming up with a completely new idea, it's always a learning experience.

I really learn what is lacking in our presentation on the Vids and on the Forum, how what we say and show comes across to a newb to the hobby, often times what we think is really straight forward and clear is not what they understand it to be

I personally feel the most valuable lesson I have come away with from the Face to Face time and at the Meets is that many of the "Sharp Tests" that we so casually toss about on here, are not as universal as many sitting at home alone seem to think

Just because the TNT TPT and AHT work for you sure doesn't mean they work anywhere near the same for other people, that is one lesson I won't ever forget and I have been trying to impress on people giving advice here on SRP ...

Nothing can replace the smile on someones face when they shave with the first razor that they have successfully honed. I have always enjoyed the time spent with people teaching them to hone and maintain their razors. I have also enjoyed hearing the stories of these people then helping the next guy on their journeys as well. I think that's what makes this such a great sport and hope that all of our members get to experience this along the way.

Keep the door open for your brothers gents and Have Fun.

Originally Posted by gssixgun

I really learn what is lacking in our presentation on the Vids and on the Forum, how what we say and show comes across to a newb to the hobby, often times what we think is really straight forward and clear is not what they understand it to be

I personally feel the most valuable lesson I have come away with from the Face to Face time and at the Meets is that many of the "Sharp Tests" that we so casually toss about on here, are not as universal as many sitting at home alone seem to think

Just because the TNT TPT and AHT work for you sure doesn't mean they work anywhere near the same for other people, that is one lesson I won't ever forget and I have been trying to impress on people giving advice here on SRP ...

The vid's you gents make are awesome. But, some things are simply not possible to accurately describe.. How much pressure is 'medium pressure' for instance.

I am finding your vid's more valuable with the more I know.

Originally Posted by Lynn

Nothing can replace the smile on someones face when they shave with the first razor that they have successfully honed. I have always enjoyed the time spent with people teaching them to hone and maintain their razors. I have also enjoyed hearing the stories of these people then helping the next guy on their journeys as well. I think that's what makes this such a great sport and hope that all of our members get to experience this along the way.

Keep the door open for your brothers gents and Have Fun.

I can only hope to be in the position to help others the way you and the other 'seniors' have.

Thanks for all you guys do to help us!!

One thing that always confused the hell out of me when I was getting started was the statement that you should be able to get a comfortable shave off of an 8k edge. You can but it shouldn't be confused with a professionally honed 20k or Jnat edge. Those two do not perform the same way. I kept thinking that the level of keenness I had known from pro honed edges was attainable off of the 8k but simply with less comfort and polish. Not knowing the limitations of any hone makes knowing when to stop or move on difficult. Videos and verbal advice may simply be inadequate in delivering that knowledge.

I'm guessing there are 20 guys beating an edge into submission as we speak. With every controversial point there is at least 100 guys on this forum that could benefit from accepting either point of view, because their current assumption is wrong. It takes time and an open mind to see the problem.