Thread: How much honing?

Ok, honestly. I have an ebay special. I've posted about it when I bought it (http://straightrazorpalace.com/showthread.php?t=10407) -- it's Vanadium by CF Ern. I looked up Vanadium and vanadium is a steel additive to supply strength.

Anyhoo -- I polished this thing up fairly nicely with a bunch of wet/dry automotive polishing sandpaper (800 and 1K grit) and some Maas, and found myself a Norton 4k/8k, and a strop.

Initially the razor was barely sharp enough to cut butter.

I have put in at least 4 pyramid series starting at 20/20. and then at 4 more visits to the 8k side with 10 passes each time. I perform an HHT after each honing, then strop and repeat the HHT, and never does the blade pass, nor does it really cut off any arm hairs or anything. I can get it to cut a beard hair if it happens to catch the thing, and then it will pull the hair apart.

So clearly, something is wrong. Should I a) hone more, b) not use exclusively x-patterned pyramids as demonstrated on Lynn's DVD or 3) invest in a belt sander.

Thanks for any input!

How about 20 passes with reduced pressure on 8K? I'd need more info to help out.

OK, we're going into diagnostic mode here. My guess is that your sanding and polishing have basically removed the bevel from the razor, and that we'll need to re-establish it before the razor is going to get sharp. (Picture doing pyramids on a butter knife. It would take a long time to get it sharp, right?)

Take a good look at the edge of your razor. Is there an even bevel on both sides of the edge, or does the blade look like it just continues on and then abruptly stops at the edge, maybe with a slight rounded taper?

Wet your thumbnail, then drag the razor slowly across it. Do you feel it biting in at all, or does it just sort of glide over the nail without making a mark?

Describe what you find from these two experiments, and we'll get you on track.

Josh

At this point there is a visible bevel that is straight and even all across, both sides. Before this honing experience there was no bevel at all.

On a thumbnail I do get a sensation of biting in -- though I don't know how severe it should feel -- I get more or less a slight sensation of increasing drag in the motion without feeling any sort of "uh-oh I'd better stop before I hurt myself."

Sounds like you're overhoning.
Try; 3/3, 5/5, 10/5, 5/5, 3/5, 1/3,1/3,1/3 with less pressure on the 4K than the 8k side.
Start with 'some' pressure overall and by the time you're at the 1/3's you should be down to very light pressure on the 4k and ultra light on the 8k.
Even all along the edge at all times.
Don't use the thumbnail test on an edge with even so much as a bevel on it. You'll ruin the edge.

X

It sounds like we're in pretty good shape. The razor should bite in pretty good without feeling gritty.

I think you need to do a few more aggressive pyramids at this stage. Use light, even strokes. Do one pyramid and then try the hanging hair test. As you get closer you want to test frequently so you can see your progress.

After one to three more pyramids I think it's time for a shave test.

Josh

Heh heh--opposite advice from X.

Following his advice would be good if you're close to shave ready. Trouble is, we don't really know how close you are. If you're still a ways off, though, it'll take forever to get there that way.

Since you took the bevel off originally and nothing's happening on the HHT, I'm inclined to think you're not that close yet.

Does it shave arm hair without any pressure? That's one test that tells me when I'm getting close. I very lightly shave my arm. If it shaves the hairs there then it's getting ready to do a light pyramid like X described. I shoot for shaving arm hair off the 4K.

Josh

Originally Posted by JoshEarl

Does it shave arm hair without any pressure? That's one test that tells me when I'm getting close. I very lightly shave my arm. If it shaves the hairs there then it's getting ready to do a light pyramid like X described. I shoot for shaving arm hair off the 4K.

Josh

I only use leg hair these days. At a certain moment my left arm was covered with bald patches. Now I have bald patches on my legs, but at least people don't see that.

Come summer I'll have to think of something else though

Originally Posted by Merovian

On a thumbnail I do get a sensation of biting in -- though I don't know how severe it should feel -- I get more or less a slight sensation of increasing drag in the motion without feeling any sort of "uh-oh I'd better stop before I hurt myself."

I do the TNT without pressure. i.e. only the weight of the razor, or even less if it is a wedge. I am satisfied if the razor bites in a way that makes me think that I'd cut through the nail if I'd apply more pressure.

Thanks for all the info!

At this point, I'm leaning more toward JoshEarl's diagnosis -- not honed enough, rather than overhoned.

I cannot get it to cut arm hairs without using some pressure, so clearly there is a long way off. I tried stropping it a while and give myself one pass with the thing this morning before finishing up with the usual materials (Merkur Classic DE) and it felt like shaving with barbed wire. Pretty hardcore, truly -- but also pretty unpleasant.

Should I at any point be doing the little circle pattern that is shown on Lynn's DVD? Or is that way too much?

Also, Josh -- by "aggressive pyramids" do you mean starting at 20 as I have been? (20/20, 15/15, 10/10, 5/5, 3/3, 1/3, 1/5) or something more or less aggressive than that?

Thanks again!

PS Bruno- - I'll have to remember that leg hair trick -- sounds like a good idea.