Thread: Honing help needed

Hi All,

I'm a new member in this forum and also a new straight razor user (complete rookie). I have recently bought a new Dovo 5/8" razor and out of the box it was really sharp, but not sharp enough to pass the hanging hair test (I know that this test is not a reliable test). I tried shaving a bit, the sideburn are, and it pulled the hair. I have looked around for a honing stone and came across quite a cheap option on amazon called Kinps Taidea, with 3000/8000 combo for £29 in UK. Bought it and after watching some videos on youtube and reading some threads about honing here, I tried to hone it. Did some passes on the 3k side and then some on 8k side. The razor did not feel dull, but not much sharper than from factory.
I decided to hone it again, but put some more work into it. I tried the circular technique on 3k side then about 10 X passes and the same ok 8k side, but after that the razor felt even duller. I think I used pretty uneven pressure as well, since the bevel became quite thin in the centre and much wider on the heel and toe sides... I tried the pyramid approach afterwards, but to no avail, the razor still pulls hair.
I know that I've ruined the bevel a little bit, but I imagine that is fixable. So I have two questions:
1) What would you guys recommend for setting a proper bevel again.
2) Is the honing stone that I've purchased good enough for honing a straight razor? Can I blame the stone for this misfortune, or is the lack of skill so bad that I have ruined the razor?

I have attached some images of how the razor looks now, and how the stone looks now (seems like on the 3k side it has some scratches which were not present).

p.s. I have also soaked the stone for quite some time, is it possible to over-soak a stone so it looses its properties?

I'm a novice, but everyone here recommends getting your blade professionally honed the first time, since it's more important to develop shaving skill first. Partially because honing is learned, and you're more likely to make things worse the first time than better.

Two things. First, never practice honing or cut your teeth on your primary razor. Because, as you've found out, it puts you out of the game until you can get it fixed up. Second, until you have read up on EVERYTHING, including prepping those stones, don't proceed. In your case, send your razor out to get it fixed up. It might just be the lighting but it looks like there is a frown developing. In any case, you don't want to make it worse. Then get another clunker to try your hand at honing......after you've read up on it some.

I would say it will be impossible to diagnose the issue because you don't have the experience to test the blade (shaving experience) or the experience to hone the blade so we couldn't know what, if anything, happened when you tried.

I would suggest having a razor professionally honed, and focus on shaving and stropping. Once you are comfortable with those two skills, you will have a way to assess your own honing.

All advise true, and if you accept you can move forward instead of backwards, until you know how to shave and strop , you really don't know what the edge is supposed to be right , maybe the edge was good but your technique wasn't ,, you never know m that is why you get one pro honed and learn to shave with it , letting the pros keep it going for you until you can tell the difference I. The edge, Good luck and honing one before you know tends to get the edge all out of whack. Tc

Starting with a pro honing is the best way to go. That said that stone can be used for a razor. From the pics you haven't lapped the stone, are using uneven strokes and the razor probably didn't have a complete bevel to start with and from experience setting a bevel on the 3k side of that stone will take a long time. Send it out and then use the 8k as a maintenance hone and start from there it will be a much easier learning curve and you will have your benchmark. Good luck

You've got the basic idea - hone it on the coarse side, then on the fine side until it's sharp.
The only problem is what happens if it doesn't get sharp enough and there are many things that could be the reason. The main culprits tend to be
- uneven strokes
- not enough strokes
- too many strokes
- too much pressure
- not enough pressure
- inadequate hone
- inadequate razor

As you can see, it's pretty hard to diagnose the case over the internet, but we try to do the best we can. Dovos are almost never bad, so that's unlikely. I don't have any idea about the hone, the grit labeling is in the ballpark of the hones most of us use (norton, naniwa, shapton) but that doesn't guarantee anything. It'd have been much better if you had picked a hone from these brands, but you can't change that now.

I do not see noticeable hone wear on the spine of the razor, so if you're not using tape to protect it I'd say you're not putting too much pressure or using too many strokes yet. If you're using tape I don't know - we then have to judge by your bevel which doesn't look very uniform but it's not terrible yet.

I think you would want to develop a way to evaluate your progress, at least that you are making progress and your razor is getting sharper. You can use your thumbpad test and a hair test, but you still have a bit of a chicken-egg problem as it takes experience. Get a pack of DE blades and check with those - if you shave with a DE razor you can use the blades after 0-1-2-3-4 shaves as benchmarks for different levels of sharpness, if not you can cut with them a piece of paper or run them over a cork to make them differently dull. Then you test with a hair and your thumbpad the difference between them and you should have some idea what sharper feels at that level. Hopefully you can then determine that your razor is making progress.

That's why we recommend that people get razor that is in a shave-ready state, as determined by a person who knows what that means. It is also much easier to maintain that state than getting there in the first place.

Definitely do some reading before proceeding. If you can find someone local to you all the better.

http://straightrazorpalace.com/memberlist.php?do=search

Use the link then type in your location in the field labeled "location", hopefully theres a mentor near.

Thanks everyone for the suggestions,help and quick responses! Especially gugi for pointing out the technique with DE razors to find out what is called a sharp blade.
I'll send out my razor to a professional honer to get it sorted and will do loads of reading now.

Thanks to OCDshaver for pointing out that I have not prepared the stones in any way, I imagine there are multiple topics about this in the forum.

So do you guys suggest to buy a used proper razor or a new but cheap one for trying out the honing (once I'm prepared for it)? Since I only have this one Dovo at the moment, I would not like to ruin it again later on.

Originally Posted by gugi

I do not see noticeable hone wear on the spine of the razor, so if you're not using tape to protect it I'd say you're not putting too much pressure or using too many strokes yet.

No, I did not use any tape while honing, figured that the wear on the spine shouldn't be too bad.
At first I did use some pressure while doing the circular technique, but then on the X pattern just used the weight of the blade.

Originally Posted by jfk742

Definitely do some reading before proceeding. If you can find someone local to you all the better.

http://straightrazorpalace.com/memberlist.php?do=search

Use the link then type in your location in the field labeled "location", hopefully theres a mentor near.

Thanks for the link, I've searched my location (Sheffield) and there are members, but how do you determine a mentor?

I'd get a used one. Keep an eye on the classifieds for something that is under $50. You want it to be good enough to take an edge and not have a lot of problems like frowns, chips in the edge. Stay away from old sheffields/wedge grinds. It can be a shortened blade too since those tend to come cheaper. It'll hone just the same. You can try eBay but you might not know what you're getting and it could be a boat load of trouble. I used to have a stash of such razors that I used to practice on. Once I got myself up and running, I handed them over to someone else to use for the same purpose. Keep an eye out for something cheap but something that won't make you pull your hair out trying to figure out.