Thread: Need Help Diagnosing Rolls Blade Problem

I have a couple of Rolls Razors that I love and trade off with my standard straight (Dovo Ebony Bismarck 6/8). I've done some refurbishing and honing of multiple Rolls sets and blades and never had a problem getting an excellent edge on my blades until the other day...

It had been a while since I'd honed the blade. Daily stropping was keeping it in good condition, but I was thinking it might be needing a touch up soon. Then I dropped it a very short distance (<1 ft) to the counter top. The way it dropped, I"m pretty sure it did not land on the blade as the blade bar was of course in place. However, I figured I was planning on touching it up, so thought this was an omen that maybe I ought to do that ;-)

I lapped it (10 each) on my 4000/8000 stones then polished it (10 laps) on my 12000 stone. I've used that process before and always got a good edge. When I was finished, the shave I got was terrible! I inspected the blade closely and noticed something odd: it seemed both lateral edges (about 1/4 of the way in from the lateral edges) were polished from the sharpening I gave it, but the middle 1/2 of the blade looked untouched. Hmmm, sounds like the blade was bent! Not so. I flipped it over expecting to find the lateral edges of the blade untouched and the center 1/2 polished if the blade edge had been bent. However, the pattern on the other side o the blade edge was identical.

I started all over again tonight and reset the bevel on my 100/1000 stones. Then went through the pyramids on my 4000/8000 stones asLynn recommends and as I always do then finished up with my 12000 polishing stone as always. When finished, the blade wouldn't cut my arm hairs and retained the lateral/center mis-aligned sharpening effect I'd seen the first time around.

My stones are fine. I lapped them all and in doing so found no evidence they were anything but nice and flat. Finally, I slapped the blade in my Rolls device and honed it 50 times. Since the Rolls hone is significantly coarser than my 12K polishing stone, I could see that even in the Rolls, the edges were getting honed, but not the center of the blade.

Any ideas what is causing this and how I can fix it?

Hopefully you understand that the spine of that blade does not set the right honing angle for that razor, which is meant to be honed in the included apparatus. You will need to tape the spine to replicate the proper angle. Regarding the uneven wear along the blade, have you checked to see if the integral hone is flat? I would guess that it is not.

I do tape the spine with the appropriate number of layers of tape for the device in which I use the blade.
The integral hone is flat. I did not mention thst I had lapped it as well.

Note that I get the uneven honing effect whether I am using the hand or Rolls device honing methods.

Originally Posted by Utopian

Hopefully you understand that the spine of that blade does not set the right honing angle for that razor, which is meant to be honed in the included apparatus. You will need to tape the spine to replicate the proper angle. Regarding the uneven wear along the blade, have you checked to see if the integral hone is flat? I would guess that it is not.

Really difficult to visualize your issue without pictures.

Originally Posted by sqzbxr

Really difficult to visualize your issue without pictures.

No pictures, but here's a more detailed description:
-Hold a Rolls blade in front of you with the engraving facing you, the spine facing the floor and the edge facing the ceiling.
-The right and left 1/4 of the 'sharpened' edge is getting honed
-The center 1/2 of the blade remains mostly untouched by honing
-I get the same effect whether hand or Rolls honing
-This is not a bevel issue in that after I hand honed the properly taped blade, the followed up with Rolls honing later, the hone marks on the left and right of the blade overlaid the bevel from base to the edge perfectly.
So when you look at one side you think the edge must be bowed away from you (center untouched, but edges honed) BUT when you turn the blade around and look at the edge from the other side, the middle 1/2 is still not being honed.

could this be a result of a frown in the blade?

Well, without seeing it, my best guess is that the shock of impact released stress in the blade and now it is deformed (warped). If so, you would need to completely reset the bevel. Being unfamiliar with the finer points of Rolls razors - and having only seen them in pictures - I don't know if this would alter the geometry past the point of usability.

Originally Posted by Shavetime

could this be a result of a frown in the blade?

Ahh, thanks for that comment. I'm educating myself on frowns and see it is repairable. I likely caused it with uneven pressure while honing. Need to lighten my touch I guess. I've found the repair guide in the library so looks like i should be able to get the edge back to normal.

The blade does not appear to be warped. That was the first thing I looked for but there is no obvious evidence of that. I suspect improper honing on my part put the frown into the blade and the short drop had nothing to do with it. We'll see after I try repairing it.

This doesn't make sense to me. If you're honing put a frown on the blade and you're doing everything the same, you should still be hitting the edge on at least one side(increasing the frown). A frown is very easy to diagnose. It's either frowning or it's not. have your hones been lapped recently? Have you also used the integral Rolls Razor hone? Could it be that your tape is not elevating the spine as high as it was during previous honing?

Bejay,
See my originsl post. all my hones have been lapped. Already tried it in the Rolls (also lapped), but that was after I'd apparently done the damage already with hand honing.
See my mire recent post(s) where I point out this is not a case of muliple bevels.
You are correct that a blade is either frowning or it is not. If I were an experienced honer this might have been obvious to me. I'm not, which is why I came here for help.
My hand honing again can fix it now that I know to take precautions with my technique after I straighten the edge.
Thanks to all for your helpful replies.