I understand there are many test out there for bevel setting. Would majority of you agree that when a bevel is set or close to being set it SHOULD cut arm hair? Thanks gents
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I understand there are many test out there for bevel setting. Would majority of you agree that when a bevel is set or close to being set it SHOULD cut arm hair? Thanks gents
If the razor won't cut arm hair, it's nowhere close to being set. It should shave hair off of the 1k. If you've honed until both sides of the blade have formed a single edge, the razor will be sharp enough to shave your face, but it will not be comfortable until you've refined the edge with higher grit stones.
Got it! That is what I was thinking should be the case. I have a Shapton glass 1k and a razor with 62hrc rating and I am having a heck of a time getting the bevel to that point. The 1k gets clogged or smooths out pretty fast and stops removing metal. Do I just keep lapping it for fresh grit until it shaves arm hair? Maybe a common sense answer but I want to make sure!Quote:
Originally Posted by Wayne1963
A loupe changed my honing immensely. You can actually look almost straight don on the edge and see if the bevel is complete. The phrase bevel set can be defined as the two planes meeting to forma perfect V for the entire length. The two sides must come to a perfect and uniform point or there is not really any point in going further.
Ditto what RezDog said about getting a loupe. I have a nice cheap 60x I got off amazon and it works great
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Yes, I would stay on your bevel setter till the blade effortlessly cuts arm hair along the entire length of the blade and confirm with a loupe that the bevel is set. Doing some light strokes past that point won't hurt it either. Sort of insurance incase you missed something with the arm hair and loupe tests. Keeps you from rushing things and going up the hones too early.
Bob
On every factory honed razor I have received I have tried the reflection test and found there is a light reflection on all my razors edges, finished edges to be exact. Even a factory feather SE super pro edge has a faint reflection, well more like a white line. Maybe my phones LED light is too bright for this test. My 60X loupe is almost dead.Quote:
Originally Posted by RezDog
I have never had a 1k shave arm hair lol. I need to go back to the drawing board...Quote:
Originally Posted by BobH
pretty sure dshaves has a loupe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dshaves
Hmmmmm Not always :)Quote:
Originally Posted by dshaves
I thought it was foolproof until the Ashville NC meet in 2009 sitting around the table passing a razor and BAM !!! one out of the 8 or so guys sitting there couldn't get it to cut arm hair at any grit level :(
Since then during all the meets I have attended there is always somebody that can't get one of the bevel set tests to work for them
Use all the tests until you have an ABSOLUTE sure fire goto method that always works for you, not what we tell you should work :p
Yeah I see your point, that is the most liberating way to learn something for sure! I purchased the Chosera 1k off of a mozon! I should get it by Friday.....Quote:
Originally Posted by gssixgun
Yes, I should have added the caveat that the shaving arm hair test works for me and it may not work for others. I also like to try and verify that test visually with a loupe. Always belt and suspenders for me. Then add a few extra light swipes just to be sure. I hate missing an unset bevel and finding out later on the shave. Still happens too often.Quote:
Originally Posted by gssixgun
Bob
I am not certain we are talking about the same thing. A light test and a loupe are different. I have not played with a loupe and a feather SE blade. I have played around with looking at DE blades and it should be the same thing, in theory. By looking with the loupe and lines and sparkle what I am referring to is like the pictures in this thread http://straightrazorpalace.com/honin...ggestions.html. Essentially what I am saying is that if you can verify your bevel is set by checking it with a loupe, that is the final say, from that you need to gauge all of your other tests.Quote:
Originally Posted by dshaves
Disposable blades have a micro bevel so yeah, white line. Factory honed straights are rarely optimal.Quote:
Originally Posted by dshaves
Got it thank you! We are talking about the same thing I realize I have yet to see in person a correctly set bevel lol...Quote:
Originally Posted by RezDog
The only time I test the edge is post the Chosera 1k. If it cuts arm hair I move on. I go naniwa superstones 2,3,5,8,10k stones, then the Suehiro 20K.
It's repeatable, works every time. I learn at bevel set if a certain razor has different properties, that need more or less work on it's bevel. I've stopped the old habit of 'edge' chasing, and now have two pass shaves on days off....lol
I went to Hell and back learning to set bevels on 1k glass stone. They do gunk up quickly....
Thankfully years later I have a Chosera 1k. That stone should win awards..
I firstly do the thumb pad test.
Then I go to the inner fore arm to shave test but I don't have to cut the hair.
I just feel the edge grip my skin and know that it is set.
Why waste valuable hair :)
Another great method. Taught to me by Max.
Lick your thumb (yummy) then place your wet thumb on the razors edge .
Try to slide your thumb forward . If it grips, then that part of the edge is set.
If it slides then it isn't set.
Ps don't cut yourself trying this :/
The Chosera 1k is a great bevel setter. I started off using a 1k SS and it drove me crazy. It needed constant lapping or it wouldn't cut. My noob reaction was frustration and too much pressure. Bevels were much less daunting with the Chosera.Quote:
Originally Posted by dshaves
What was the condition of the blade before you started working on it? What kind of a grind is it ? Some blades just take a lot of work to get a good bevel.
I've also got to agree with gssixgun about trying all of the bevel test. Most guys will figure out a "go to" test that works every time FOR THEM. I personally use a few test, but the TNT has the final say. Keep trying them all throughout the process and they will start to make sense. You will see how each test looks/feels before the bevel is set, and see how each changes as the bevel comes in.
Where is the "middle of CA"? I'm located in the east bay. Maybe I could give you some hands on help.
Yea, not always, depends on your hair. Test your hair, with a razor blade.
Are you using tape?
Try adding one layer of tape and ink the bevels with colored sharpie ink. When you ink, lightly slide the sharpie on the edge from heel to toe, the edge should feel smooth, you will at the same time ink both sides of the bevel at the edge. Colored ink is easier to see.
Now do a couple of laps with light pressure and see if the ink is removed all the way to the edge. The 1k shapton should easily set the edge.
Be careful about pressure, if hollow ground, too much pressure will lift the edge, by causing the back of the bevel to act as a fulcrum. You will remove ink, but not at the edge. You can hone all day long and never touch the edge.
If you are still having trouble, send me the razor and I will look at it, take some photos of the edge and hone it for you. Or get with BeJay.
At skin level it should.Quote:
Originally Posted by dshaves
I will be receiving my Chosera 1k this Friday...It didn't dawn on me that when a stone gunks up that means it pretty much stops removing metal until you re lap it over and over again! I will try all the bevel test again when I have a properly set one lol.Quote:
Originally Posted by JOB15
Yeah! I live in the east bay too. I would really appreciate that!Quote:
Originally Posted by BeJay
Just one point on stones 'gunking' up, or blocking pores in the stone to prevent it cutting properly. I do believe that happens, but, to re lap completely, maybe unnecessary. As a general practice I do with every stone right up to the Suehiro 20k. I do six figure 8's with an Atoma 400 lapping plate. I have always felt that the surface of a hone functions better if it is 'disrupted'. What I'm getting at is if you have 6 razors that all need bevel work, then in between razors I'd do 6 figure 8's to clean the surface.
Bob
I think that's what most of us are talking about. About 10 seconds on a diamond plate to give you a fresh surface. If you do your initial grid lapping when you get the stone this will maintain its flatness indefinitely.Quote:
Originally Posted by bobski
PS. Super Stones will swell when they are wet. Always wet them for 5-10 minutes before lapping.
A stiff brass brush, like the one in the DMT maintenance kit, will clean up most stones without lapping.Quote:
Originally Posted by BeJay
This is a great thread. My only immediate problem is, I seem to have lost my loupe. Murphy says that I will find it as soon as I give up any hope and purchase a new one. I am hoping Murphy is wrong and I will find it quickly. So far all loupe hunting expeditions have been unsuccesful. :(
I do only refresh the stone to free up new grit, not re lap sorry about the using the wrong term, lapping a stone and re refreshing a stone are two different things :) I now don't believe the SG 1k or the NSS 1k are just 'gunking' up, I think in 'theory' the grit itself is smoothing out or laying down like man made crop circles. No matter what I have done to clean the surface either with some kind of scrubber or Scotch brite pad etc. the stone wont cut anymore refresh the surface! So glad and thankful these pro honers are willing to shed light on the subject!!!
A small Arkansas stone that you can buy usually for less then $5 at any knife place or garage sale works great to "Re-fresh between razors or to raise a light slurry on most all of these softer Waterstones
Just remember the smaller the stone you use the faster the hone will get out of flat..
That is exactly why I recommended using a few figure 8's with a Diamond Plate before each razor on so many vids :)
It keeps the Hone flat raises a light slurry if you like, and exposes the cutting surface of the hone
Attachment 248500 I got that Chosera 1k woooooo!
