Thread: New honer needing some advise

I would try using a layer or two of of tape, heel forward X strokes with some tourqe towards the heel.

Or......

Send it off and practice with a razor with no sentimental value. As john said the best way to begin honing (IMO) is to maintain a shave ready razor.

Good luck

Originally Posted by Wayne1963

I think all 3 of your solutions would work. BUT, since you are attached to the razor, I would hone my skills (bad pun) on a razor you're not afraid to mess up. Try PMing Lynn or Glen for their opinions.

The more I'm thinking about it, I may try to send this one out to a pro. I still have a Boker I can sharpen, and have sharpened. I may try a few of the rolling x strokes first though. I doubt me getting it, but it'd be a learning experience. If I do send it, would be in bad form to ask them to finish it with the norton 8k? I think it'd give a good benchmark if I ever try again.

Originally Posted by Euclid440

Is that rust on the bevel or ink, the spots? What does the other side look like?

A photo of the razor without your thumb on the heel, on both sides would help.

You can easily set a bevel on a Norton 4k, but the razor may have issues. What those issues are, will determine how to hone it. The condition of the spine and edge may tell the tail.

More than likely there is some warp in the blade, set it on a flat surface on both sides and see the condition.
Colored ink is easier to see, and will not be confused with a shadow or rust mark.

Use 2 layers of tape, to set the bevel, then once set, drop down to one layer. But first post some better photos so we might figure out what is going on.

What you should do, depends, if you just want to shave, send it out for honing. If you want to learn to hone, post some photos and we can get you over the hump. If you can find a local mentor, you will cut your learning curve dramatically.

Those spots are the spots I put along the edge with a black sharpie. I went with black because it's the only color sharpie I own.

The opposite side seems to be flat with a decent bevel. I placed sharpie marks on it as well and they were removed with a few strokes on the 4K. The pictured side though,
the the marker wasn't removed around the area about 1/3 up it. It was removed before and after that area. The good looking side also moves water better than the bad side.

Setting the bevel with 2 layers and then removing 1 for the finer honing confuses me. Wouldn't doing that create a situation where the finer stone wouldn't be able to contact the cutting edge of the bevel and instead cause you to hone the back edge of the bevel?

Originally Posted by Maladroit

New production TIs have a problematic reputation, that is some have very uneven bevels that are challenging to correct. If yours is one of these I'd recommend you send it to a pro to have the bevel properly set and the edge brought to where it should be.

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I hope mine isn't too bad off. I'd like to get it Honda Ke by me one day.

Originally Posted by MisterClean

Get a 1k to set your bevel. My 2cents...

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I'd love to, however I have other items that need purchased first. Perhaps next year for my birthday or Father's Day.


I'll post another couple pics to see if they help show what I'm thinking and seeing. It's almost like they sharpened one side at the factory with too much pressure and thinned one spot out a little too much. They got the other side correct.

Hopefully these will capture the blade decently. Its difficult for me to capture it well with my phone.

Originally Posted by Hirlau

The way I see your photos;
1. Your spine is consistant with your edge problem, the edge is not being honed other than the last 1/3 from the toe. Look at your spine, I see wear that would cause your problem. You can double layer it, as suggested above, that might level the spine enough to lay the edge flat.

2. I'd layer it & rework/reset the edge at the 4K. I would not leave the 4K until the problem is solved.

3. Touch-up of a previous shave ready blade is "honing". The place to begin your honing journey, IMO. So, as suggested about, get a standard set by sending it out & then maintaining it with your 8K or whatever finisher you have.

I'm beginning to think a send out is in order. When I have some more time tonight I'll try to study the spine area and see if I can spot what you're referring too. Even if I can't personally correct the problem yet, I'd like to figure out what is happening and why.

Since it has sentimental value, I'd suggest sending it out. You can still practice on your Boker, and work on your technique(s), and always get more blades in the future that you can hone. Sooner or later you'll get blades that have issues and you can work on them to learn more.

You can always keep the TI as your "reference edge" for comparing the results of other blades that you hone.

It'll be good to get a 1k to round out your setup, but for maintence on blades that aren't real problem blades, the 4K will do the job - just might take longer. No rush in getting one.

Originally Posted by cstilt

I'm hoping to get this razor in great shape because it's my favorite (of only 2) razors. I bought it the day my wife and I married so it's a bit sentimental to me.

Honing like a wife takes practice!

Yea, the blade is warped, not uncommon for a new Thiers Issard from AOS.

But first, you are honing on the stabilizer and keeping the heel off the stone. You have ground down the stabilizer on one side where the heel is honed to the edge, but keeping the other side off the stone. When honing on the stabilizer, most folks just use more pressure, until they grind the stabilizer until the heel portion of the bevel is making contact. Don't do that...

Note the heel portion of the bevel is not hitting on one side. The toe bevel, is not hitting on the opposite side and there is very little wear on the spine over the toe, because of the warp. But it is not badly warped. An X stroke will easily hone the entire bevel.

You can hone it on a 4k, but must, remove some steel. So, you should use tape to protect the spine. Once you remove steel from the spine, you can never put it back, and most new honers use, too much pressure and do too many laps. The spine gets needlessly excessively ground.

I recommend 2 layers of tape, until you get a solid bevel on both sides, you will be using some pressure and doing some laps. 2 layers of tape will protect the spine, because it is easy to burn through a single layer. You will learn to feel when you burn through, the spine feel sticky or you feel the bits of tape in the slurry as a slight bump.

Once you have set the bevel fully, then remove all the tape and put on a fresh single layer and reset the bevel to the new angle. It should not take too many laps to reset, using an x stroke. Use 1 layer from then on.

The heel also needs re-shaping, as a hook is starting to form and is now a sharp corner. Now is the time to fix that, or that corner will cut you.

Re-shaping the heel, will also bring the corner of the edge further forward and well out of the way of the stabilizer.

So, 2 layers of tape and some circles, in set of 20, concentrating on the heel on one side and toe on the other. Ink the bevels. Pay attention to the ink removal and the wear on the tape, until you have a continuous bevel on both sides. Then do X strokes to eve out the bevels and set an even stria pattern on the bevels.

An investment in a colored sharpie, will allow you to easily track your progress, with the naked eye. Colored ink is easy to see. I use Red and Blue.

Cstilt,

Before damaging your razor due to advice you got here, get out that sharpie again please. I really don't care which color you use. Mark the entirety of the stabilizers on both sides of the razor. Now hone a few strokes in exactly the same manner that you have done previously and use whatever taping arrangement that you used before. Please report back on what you see happens to the stabilizers. Photos would be helpful but you also could just describe it.

I think you might find this article of some use, it just by happenstance is based on a TI from AOS


http://straightrazorpalace.com/honin...-you-leap.html

Originally Posted by Utopian

Cstilt,

Before damaging your razor due to advice you got here, get out that sharpie again please. I really don't care which color you use. Mark the entirety of the stabilizers on both sides of the razor. Now hone a few strokes in exactly the same manner that you have done previously and use whatever taping arrangement that you used before. Please report back on what you see happens to the stabilizers. Photos would be helpful but you also could just describe it.

If I get some free time tonight I'll try to get some pics like you asked for.