Thread: Ding near toe... go right to the 1K?

There are a lot of relatively deep stria right at the edge that fade as you move up the bevel. In the second picture, the roughness of the edge is very apparent, much more so than it should be after a 12k Naniwa. That indicates to me that you have been mostly polishing the bevel behind the edge while leaving the edge still rough. If the bevel was truly set, you'd be polishing all the way to the edge.

Originally Posted by sqzbxr

There are a lot of relatively deep stria right at the edge that fade as you move up the bevel. In the second picture, the roughness of the edge is very apparent, much more so than it should be after a 12k Naniwa. That indicates to me that you have been mostly polishing the bevel behind the edge while leaving the edge still rough. If the bevel was truly set, you'd be polishing all the way to the edge.

Thanks for the clarification. It's been several months since I did some honing, and I need to relearn some of the steps.


sent from my phone.

This is an enlarged section of your second photo with the brightness and contrast tweaked a little to show the stria at the edge:

I wouldn't accept that edge even off a 1K.

I personally would go to the 1k and perform rolling X strokes with little pressure .

Also making sure I didn't do too much .. Easier said than done without experience.

Here is a 1k edge I did recently. Your 1k edge should look a bit more like this imo:

Originally Posted by JOB15

I wouldn't accept that edge even off a 1K.

I personally would go to the 1k and perform rolling X strokes with little pressure .

Also making sure I didn't do too much .. Easier said than done without experience.

Here is a 1k edge I did recently. Your 1k edge should look a bit more like this imo:

How wide is your bevel in this picture? My bevel is about 0.5mm in the center of the blade and near 1mm at the edges (so this picture is pretty high magnification). It definitely has deeper/more stria than the heel and toe (I was really concentrating on the toe, because of the ding). I'll try to work on it with the 4K as soon as I get another chance, and see how it comes out. I didn't get to test shave it this morning (forgot to bring it up into the bathroom last night).

Thanks. Yeah the heel looks good, but not so much on the toe. Will try pressure or rolling x stroke tomorrow.

sent from my phone.

Not trying to be harsh but I think you missed the point of using 2 layers of tape.
If your pressure was light enough you would have ended up with a secondary bevel but your bevel set problem would be fixed.
It should have put you right onto the edge in no time yet it looks like you decided to cut a whole new bevel propagating your original issues


I would advise against adding finger pressure at this point but judging by all your pics & the varying bevel width your razor has a slight warp you are not dealing with by using an ideal stroke to compensate or you are using uneven pressure.

Fixing that toe should take no more than 5-10 featherlight strokes if you use a slight rolling X. No jointing needed.

Originally Posted by onimaru55

Not trying to be harsh but I think you missed the point of using 2 layers of tape.
If your pressure was light enough you would have ended up with a secondary bevel but your bevel set problem would be fixed.
It should have put you right onto the edge in no time yet it looks like you decided to cut a whole new bevel propagating your original issues

I was trying to get rid of the circular and deeper stria, and with the time I spent on the bevel, I lost the secondary bevel (it was there for a period of time). I guess I could have stayed on one layer.

I would advise against adding finger pressure at this point but judging by all your pics & the varying bevel width your razor has a slight warp you are not dealing with by using an ideal stroke to compensate or you are using uneven pressure.

Trying to parse this statement. Can you elaborate? The bevel, from the start, was uneven. Largest at the heel, narrowest at about a 1/3 from the toe, and then in-between at the toe. What would be the ideal stroke to compensate, so that I can learn how to deal with this blade? Early on, when using the 4K, I was just using a heel forward stroke. Later, on the 1K, I've been doing an X-stroke.

Fixing that toe should take no more than 5-10 featherlight strokes if you use a slight rolling X. No jointing needed.

I can try that. Had to do that for the first time, with a near wedge months ago, so I can try that again and see if the toe cleans up.

Because the bevel is uneven, wider at the toe than the heel on the one side you have photographed, it is probably slightly warped and this is the convex side.

So, when the razor sits on the stone the toe and middle, (at the edge), are just off the stone and not making full contact. Which is why in photo 3 of post 32 you have a double bevel, at the toe, where the back of the bevel is riding on the stone, the edge is not making full contact.

Keep in mind the warp is very slight.

So, there are 2 schools of thought, hone an edge, by removing material on the stone, at the edge until you get to good steel and the bevels meet and straighten the edge. Or straighten the edge, by jointing, then hone, to that straight edge, to get the bevels to meet at an edge, that is already straight and chip free.

You will remove exactly, the same amount of material, (very little), but either way you must, remove the flashing to get to good steel. It is just personal preference and either way works, the results are exactly the same.

Now because there is a warp in the blade, a straight stroke is not as effective and you must use a rolling X stroke, lift the heel slightly to hone the toe of the convex side and drop the heel off the stone to hone the middle on the concave side. A very slight rolling X will do both.

Or you can add a bit of pressure where the edge is not on the stone fully, remember the warp is very slight. Either way works.

Keep in mind this is a very slight rolling X, not like some of the smiling edge, rolling x videos, where the heel is lifted an 1/8 to a ¼ of an inch. As I said earlier, it is almost just thinking about lifting the heel, is enough, very slight pressure lifting of the heel, to get the toe to make contact.

And letting the heel fall off the stone on the opposite side. Here, some sharpie ink will help you see your progress and where you are making progress.

Try both techniques to find one that works for you. Keep in mind that none of us hone exactly, the same way, you have to find a technique that works for you. And keep a bag of tricks to resolve issues with each razor, sometimes one technique will work on one spot sometimes you empty the bag to hone the whole razor.

I often use just a bit of pressure on the toe, as most razors are not perfectly flat and I do a modified X stoke, rolling slightly when needed to blend a bevel.

There are no rules, whatever it takes.

PCM,
You said you used two layers of tape and replaced it once. How much more honing did you do after replacing the tape?

I ask because that second tape also wears, so when you are ready to finish using a hone, especially a bevel setter, you would be served best by using fresh tape for just the final 10-15 light strokes. That will ensure that you have a clean edge.