Thread: Coticule driving me to drink!

What I do varies widely. It all depends on what the blade needs, what I'm trying to achieve, and what I feel like doing that day. I've got a small variety of hones, and simply enjoy rotating them all and playing with them. Naturals are my favorites, so the synthetics only come out when I need more heavy work done, or I'm looking to test a new hone's capacity relative to a high grit synthetic. Barber hones are the exception, 2 of those reside in the shaving den in case the razor I want to use isn't quite up to snuff.

The original objective was to test the new coticule relative to the synthetic 8K. I botched that test, then sidetracked myself trying to touch up/fix the edge with nothing but the coticule. I guess this is why you don't jump in with both feet on an unfamiliar stone?

I feel like this stone probably can do what I'm trying to accomplish with it. I just don't know it well enough to squeeze the performance out of it. Yet.

Update:

Torrey razor on the Norton hones shaved better, but still not what I would call 'right.' Still slightly off. The Germania Cutlery Works was passable for an 8K.

In regard to the coticule, with respect to ekretz's suggestion I took the burnishing one step further. I had a Morley & Sons clover stamp sitting out with intent to hone it on my Welsh slates. So no harm would come from using it as a guinea pig...I picked it up and ran it lightly over the coticule about 500 times, on top of the 300 rounds the wrench got the day before.



That's what the swarf of 500 passes of a Morley looked like, if anyone can glean anything from that.

So with a positive shave test from the GCW, I took it to the coticule. I got a little carried away analyzing the difference that's been made in the hone so far. Before when I drew a razor across this stone there was a noticeable draw. Like the coticule wanted to catch hold of the razor and not let it loose. Post burnishing I would say the draw is comparable to a translucent Arkansas. Akin to drawing the blade over wet ice. I was also doing some mental math. Most of my hones are 3x8, this is closer to 2x7. 24 square inches of hone vs 14, less surface area, less of the blade being worked each stroke, meaning stroke count should probably increase somewhere in the ballpark of %50 on this stone compared to say my PHIG?

Well, that's assuming equivalent speed and fine-ness of hones. Somewhere in the order of 160 laps later...



No appreciable swarf built up. No hint of slurry, unless we count the schmutz the bottom side picked up off my Norton hone case/stand thing. The shave? Well, it's getting better. Still a downgrade in both comfort and performance from a Norton 8K. The razor burn I can safely attribute to opting for a warm shave - I know with my skin this always results in razor burn. But the edge was harsh and tugged more than it ought to.

Well for kicks and grins, clean wet hone:



And dry:



So at this point I've come to the conclusion that maybe, just maybe, there's potential for this rock to be a finisher. I still have some hope for it. Or it could just become a natural bevel setter for lighter work with slurry. But it was purchased as a finisher, and that's the goal I'm going to continue to strive toward. Maybe a tiny bit more burnishing and/or a little shave lather as a final phase will bring us to the finish line...? I suppose we'll find out when my face heals up.



Edit: Oh - if you're looking at those lines in the center & left side of the hone and thinking the same thing I was, they're actually not scratches/low spots. I fussed with them quite a bit before I finally took a tooth pick, sharpened up the point, and ran it perpendicular to all those little lines. The surface is as smooth and flat as it'll get. Quite possibly literally at this point, but I'm hoping I can nudge it just a teeny bit more smooth/fine.

Originally Posted by Marshal

What I do varies widely. It all depends on what the blade needs, what I'm trying to achieve, and what I feel like doing that day. I've got a small variety of hones, and simply enjoy rotating them all and playing with them. Naturals are my favorites, so the synthetics only come out when I need more heavy work done, or I'm looking to test a new hone's capacity relative to a high grit synthetic. Barber hones are the exception, 2 of those reside in the shaving den in case the razor I want to use isn't quite up to snuff.

The original objective was to test the new coticule relative to the synthetic 8K. I botched that test, then sidetracked myself trying to touch up/fix the edge with nothing but the coticule. I guess this is why you don't jump in with both feet on an unfamiliar stone?

I feel like this stone probably can do what I'm trying to accomplish with it. I just don't know it well enough to squeeze the performance out of it. Yet.

Honestly, I think absolutely EVERYTHING you have described here is just fine. I work in a somewhat scientific field and I have to be organized, methodical, and efficient. I have to keep records of the work that I do.

I choose to do none of those things when PLAYING with my hones.

Go ahead and jump in with both feet. Do whatever you want with your toys and eventually you will figure them out. It does not need to be organized, methodical, or efficient. Just enjoy the journey however you choose to take it.

I love what you wrote here...

"I feel like this stone probably can do what I'm trying to accomplish with it. I just don't know it well enough to squeeze the performance out of it. Yet."

That's perfect!

Making progress at least, that's good. Eventually you'll find the way to the sweet spot. In addition to trying out the use of lather for finishing, do also try glycerine - and I would try oil as well. With the stone polished up it will wash right off. If you're worried about trying oil, put a drop in the corner and let it set a few minutes. Then wash the stone with dish soap and make sure that it removes all the oil.

Yeah, that's why I'm not calling it quits just yet. Maybe a few hundred more laps with the Morley will smooth it out. Could still get something out of it with lather, or if all else fails like you said there's glycerin and oil. And there's a LOT of different oils out there to test...

I was thinking about getting a soft/surgical black I could use with honing oil anyway, so I'm not averse to oil stones. I just want to exhaust the water methods first, once it goes oil it likely isn't going to revert to a water stone. Unless it can't finish, even with 5w-30 (last resort, I only have limited access to free 15-40). In that case all's lost and it's only really useful as a natural bevel setter.

I'm not sure if you're joking or not on the 5w-30 and 15w-40, so just to be safe, that is not the oil you would use for honing.

My Coticule needs less than weight of the blade pressure to get great edges (about 60 laps). Another trick that works well with mine that I've done a few times is adding a layer of tape just before the final laps creating a micro bevel. On my stone doing these I've gotten several of the best edges I've ever honed (YMMV as every stone is different). Coticule's also seem to like some steels more than others, mine works best with old Sheffield razors.

Originally Posted by Utopian

I'm not sure if you're joking or not on the 5w-30 and 15w-40, so just to be safe, that is not the oil you would use for honing.

Little of column A, little of column B. I've used it on Arkies for pocket knives in a pinch when there was nothing else around. Pretty sure I don't want that on a shaving razor though. I've got some actual honing oil at work I'd consider using.

I'm not sure my ham-hands are capable of lighter pressure than I used, but who knows? Always room for improvement right? A faint secondary bevel might just be worth trying too, I hadn't thought of that.

I like Sham's trick to controlling (and describing) the pressure, here:

https://youtu.be/S0kLxgkOtM4

Most of the coticules I've tried required a similar technique for finishing, sometimes combined with honing under running water.

That's the video that really helped me with correct pressure. You should really try this

Originally Posted by Srdjan

I like Sham's trick to controlling (and describing) the pressure, here:

https://youtu.be/S0kLxgkOtM4

Most of the coticules I've tried required a similar technique for finishing, sometimes combined with honing under running water.