Thread: And again: Japanese naturals

Hi all,

Just sharing a little new info I received in my quest for the ultimate hone. Seems to me Japanese naturals are impossible to encompass for a foreigner who doesn't have a lot of time and other resources or a good Japanese tutor. I am close to throwing the towel, so any additional info, suggestions, experience, etc are more than welcome.

Note - the person sells Honyama stones but did not recommend them for a razor. I am not sure why. I know they have been mentioned here before.

SO here it goes, from the horse's mouth:

Hello sir.
Jp Razor finished with Nakayama ,Ohzuku ,Okudo stone.All of them wrer born in Tomae stratum ,which has very smooth grit and the hardest stones.
Softer stones is good at to declease a chip of blead.It was suitable for all kinds of steel.
Top class softer stones sometimes become a Kumori (makr a mist and haze) stone.
We must know where the stone come from.
As we can estimate the hardness ,class and abrasion power.
I am recommended to the South of Mt.Atago stones (mine # 1-5) to finish a razor..
I think the #Razor size (Apllox. size 80x145mm) if you try to finish a razor.
Thank you !!

Cheers
Ivo

I take it he means Eastern stones when he says South of Mt atago. I've never heard them refered to as from the South before though. Was this a Mr nakaoka by any chance?

Originally Posted by murph

I take it he means Eastern stones when he says South of Mt atago. I've never heard them refered to as from the South before though. Was this a Mr nakaoka by any chance?

Murph,

I have seen your name in previous Japanese stones discussions and am glad you stopped by

I think that this is, indeed, Nakaoka-san, even though I have communications under another name - Mifuqwai, iirc. Is this a bad or good news?

Thanks
Ivo

Yes, I think he also goes under that name as a seller. He also has another for Yahoo japan I think.
He seems like a decent guy, although I've only bought 4 or 5 stones from him in the past as he doesn't have quite a large enough range of mines and types for me (I'm still trying to get a decent spread of stones from all the mines so I can see any differences.)
His English isn't great, which can make it difficult to obtain just want you want from him if you don't know just what your looking for to start with. Not that it's that bad as I couldn't do half as well in Japanese.
I think he must use translation software at times to try and express concepts but we all know how well that tends to work out from trying to read Japanese pages via babelfish.

Tomae is a very homengenous layer iirc and commands a premium because of this. The stones they use/d for razors where often very hard as well and I've been told they aren't suitable for beginners (which would probably cover most of us in their eyes.) Of course when your dropping seroius money for a stone most dealers will be willing to take it back if you find it doesn't suit you but because of the distance, postage and tax costs this isn't cheap for us either.

You're in Europe? Have you thought about trying some of the cheaper stones available here to start with or just buying a couple of the cheaper Japanese ones to see if you like them. Having to dig out or avoid hard spots is quite common with these stones though.

No, Murph - I am in USA.

I don't want to spend serious $$$ just to try it (how we define "serious $"?) - I am thinking my best bet is to try to get a top grade but a very small. I have great success working with small stones, and they must be cheaper - at least compared to the large ones. I was thinking I should be able to get a top grade small stone for / under $100? If it's THE STONE (whatever it is) then I will be willing to pay more - but not too much as this is just experimenting so I have to keep it reasonable (for my budget)

Thank you for the information you shared - it seems then that hard stones are indeed favored for finishing razors (vs. the Y/G Escher, and I think Coticules are soft - relatively - too).

I just saw there is a stone that's worth $80,000 - Who can afford to buy this??? Crazy. I wonder how little it cost when it was cut...

Cheers
Ivo

I guess you could get a half decent one in a strange shape or size for $100. As you've noticed a number of them go for silly money. Sometimes they seem to think your mental if you ask for a small stone, especially as you go down the grits where the naturals get bigger and bigger.

You guys don't have the hassle of duty, and VAT (sales tax) on both the shipping and item cost along with a considerable handling fee, do you? This should make your budget go a bit further.

You might get an small stone from the okudo mine for around that price. If he does have a decent looking one that he says would do I'd go for it as okudo stones aren't available that often at low prices.

I got to use a $500 Japanses Awase stone for a while and really did not find the results from it any better than the Coticule or Escher.

Dang......$80K and I just bought a new Shotgun........hahahahahahaha

Lynn