Thread: A little pressure helped

I thought this was a little interesting and so I thought I would share.

I just finished restoring a blade that I had off to the side for some while and I began honing it up.

I wanted a little practice on my shaptons, trying to attack my previous issue I call the "fuzzy apex". My progression is 1k chosera, and 2k, 4K, 8k, 16k shaptons and finally a 20k gokumyo. I call it a "fuzzy apex" because the bevel would be polished except for the very apex. Thus is the reason I normally go for my jnat and slurry stones because they tend to help me avoid this issue. But I wanted to overcome the "fuzzy apex"

Got the bevel set and was going up the progression and at either the 4K or the 8k (can't quite remember) I got the "fuzzy apex", but only on the push stroke side. It was polished in the middle of the bevel but fuzzy at the back and apex of the bevel. But on the pull stroke was all polished.

Now previously I read and understand that too much pressure possibly can cause the apex to flex up off the stone and thus not come in contact which I can see why. So I thought, "ok lighten up on the pressure". So I began hand honing with lighter and lighter pressure and seeing no change on either side of the bevel.

So I tried something different and commit a little razor honing sacrilege and added a small amount of pressure. (since most of us talk about pressure as the devil of honing, which most of the time it is). I decided to focus the pressure only on the push strokes while keeping the pull as is, and to my surprise the entire bevel became polished after a few strokes.

I test shaved at the 8k and it was wonderful. So I progressed up to my 20k and it was a revelation to the difference.

So I thought I would share. Maybe to help someone to think outside of the box to try getting the results one wants.

Thanks for reading,
Neil

It's just hard to put into words "how much" pressure is light or too much. Especially at the 8K and below. It, as you know, becomes a 'feel thing', only after you "get it." I am, by no means, an experienced honer, by comparison. However, after I "got it", I feel I can hone to the best of my current hones abilities.

Originally Posted by AcesandEights

It's just hard to put into words "how much" pressure is light or too much. Especially at the 8K and below. It, as you know, becomes a 'feel thing', only after you "get it." I am, by no means, an experienced honer, by comparison. However, after I "got it", I feel I can hone to the best of my current hones abilities.

Very much this. It goes without saying if you're using enough pressure to flex the edge, it's probably in the realm of too much and you'll never get a good edge.

Generally speaking I do use some pressure on the first 2 stones (for me that's usually 1K and 4K) and on the 8K and above little if any unless I see for some reason the polish isn't going all the way to the edge and I need to remove more steel. It's one of those things you need to tweak as needed, bearing in mind that you want to end with less rather than more.

Yup, pressure is the most difficult thing to describe, except for more, or less.

But you do need some pressure, especially at the low grit stones. I do circles on all but the finish stone, with pressure, to remove material, (at bevel set) or stria when moving up in stone grit.

As said with hollow grinds, be careful not to flex the blade and lift the edge off the stone.

The best tool to learn about pressure is Ink, it will tell you a lot about what is going on. If you use pressure, always finish with light pressure on each stone and study the ink or stria pattern as you did.

Be careful using slurry or naturals that leave a hazy bevel pattern and fooling yourself that you are making progress, because the slurry makes a more even pattern. Kazumi patterns can get finer and more even with pressure, slurry thickness, worked fineness and stone or toma.

Slurry itself can add a lot of variables, so watch the edge for straightness. What happens on the bevel either with synthetics or naturals, does not matter, except at the edge, though when learning, can be an indicator. Don’t get too caught up in it, watch the edge.

Eventually as you learn your stones and razors, some harder and or flexing easier, you will figure out the amount of pressure that works for you.

If you use too much pressure, the edge will get chippy, which killing the edge will easily solve. Once the bevels are flat, an edge can easily and quickly be re-set in a few laps.

The "little pressure" was not the issue. The term "setting the bevel" is a misnomer because it should be setting the BEVELS. The edge is formed by the meeting of both bevels. Just because one bevel plane was cut all the way to its apex does not mean the other one is too. I many times have explained the setting of the bevels to be the conversion of a "U" shape to a "V" shape, but both sides do not always reach that state at the same time.

This is why you have to look at both sides of the blade, as well as look down on the edge. One bevel can appear done while the other one is not. When that is the case, you don't yet have an edge. You have to keep honing till the bevels meet, regardless of the amount of pressure used.

... and then after 4K you don't have the fuzzy edge anymore. No pressure needed, just careful observation and hair test (on your arm). You will notice hair falls off with less and less effort as you move up the grits, till it finally starts popping in the finishing stages.

Sometimes on some blades pressure can be your friend. If I feel like a blade might need more pressure I will lay the blade almost flat on my thumbnail and apply some downward torque and pull it across the nail that way you can see the flex, if I don't see much I feel safer with more pressure