Thread: Getting the Most out of an Escher

And I finish to water only.

Humor aside, though that previous post was no joke, when I used to hone a lot more than I do now I used Eschers quite a bit. Still have one I'm hanging on to. Sham told me years ago that honing a razor that isn't already shave ready is a waste of good stone on an Escher. Get it up to speed on your stone of choice and then finish on your Escher.

I've done it like the label says, with a thin slurry and dilute to water only, and I've done it water only. Gary Haywood bought a yellow green from me. A Barber's Delight. He was mostly a coticule honer at that time and said he thought the edges were 'too crisp' compared with the coticule edge. I know what he meant. Still, IME an Escher finished edge is not as 'crisp' as a synthetic finished edge. So it might depend on what the end user is expecting out of the hone. IMHO.

I am a very big fan of the JNat edges I have been getting from both Kiita and Asagi stones. My preferred edge is the bit smoother one I get from the Kiita I have. However tonight I'm doing a bit of an experiment and taking what I would consider a finished JNat edge from that Kiita and putting it on a dark blue Escher. I also have a light green and yellow green so if you gentlemen think I should be selecting a different Escher for this please let me know.

I am interested to see the results. I'm thinking it will enhance the smoothness of the edge while retaining the keenness. But I could be totally off.

Originally Posted by Matt1222

I am a very big fan of the JNat edges I have been getting from both Kiita and Asagi stones. My preferred edge is the bit smoother one I get from the Kiita I have. However tonight I'm doing a bit of an experiment and taking what I would consider a finished JNat edge from that Kiita and putting it on a dark blue Escher. I also have a light green and yellow green so if you gentlemen think I should be selecting a different Escher for this please let me know.

I am interested to see the results. I'm thinking it will enhance the smoothness of the edge while retaining the keenness. But I could be totally off.

I had a really good dark blue years ago. Sold it to a fellow in Switzerland, so I guess you could say it went home. IME the dark blue was a slow stone. It would get there, but not quickly. About 10 years ago I asked Tim Zowada, who had a herd of Eschers in all colors, which he liked best and he said the Blue/Green. Lynn said the same when I asked him. Neither one used slurry with it at that time.

Tony Miller, the strop man used to sell Thuringans and the occasional vintage Escher when he ran up on one. He told me that the Jewish Rabbis and kosher butchers were only interested in Yellow/Green Eschers. On the old price lists the Y/G was the most expensive. I have had a couple come and go that were not only labelled gelb grun, or yellow green, on the end, but labelled 'Guaranteed Soft' on the other end. Seems softer made for faster, yet still fine with the Y/G. At one time Sham claimed that he had a Light Green (labelled) that was the best Escher he ever had.

That was years ago and he may have found another that beat it, but I haven't been in touch with him in years, so I don't know. Since you have all of those to try just keep experimenting with them. TBH I don't know if following a really good j-nat edge with an Escher, whatever the color, is going make it better. It will make it different, and you might like the difference better. Depends on what you like in an edge. Sometimes the sharpest edge isn't the one I like the best, but everybody is different when it comes to this sport.

Eschers usually should be very consistent, you can get the odd one out that is an underperformer.

The biggest problem I've heard about and experienced with one I got rid of awhile ago, was a stone that had been contaminated with oil or some other substance. The stone may look fine, but if its been loaded with a heavy oil, its essentially dead. The one I had was terrible, gave it to Val to try out, and he said it produced a terrible edge.

I've had the best results using water only, after a solid refresh on the Nani 12k or some other stone that produces a great finish.

Personally, I've also got some great edges going from a Coticule and then to an Escher....Wolfpack, an SRP member here, did some razors for me that he had honed from a Coti to an Escher and they were stellar.

As always, comes down to lots of practice with a stone....I've stuck to one finishing method for 3 years now and still learn something every time....I've dabbled trying a few others on occasion, but focus on learning one stone is key I figure, once you get the maximum from one, you'll have learned how to approach other stones I figure.....

To tell you the truth I've pretty much hung up my natural stones (a coticule and an Escher and a Thuringian) and use the Super Stone and a 20K Gokumyo as my finishers.

It's not that my naturals were bad or anything. I have a blue/green Escher and it works great but it's more barber stone size and can be tedious to use. Pretty much it was to refine the edge to the final degree and it gave a uniquely smooth edge. If the razor didn't shave pretty darn good before the Escher it simply wasn't Escher material yet.

The synthetics are big and very consistent and give a great edge and that's the story.

True, but there are those who like to experiment. Great edges are to be had.

My favorite thing about the Escher finisher is you can stay on it forever until you feel it. If you never feel it, you were not there to begin with.

Backhone a few strokes, hit the strop progression. Bingo!
Lasting edge!

Depends on the mood!

When I said I used my stone with quite some slurry and finish on plain water, it's on a very dark blue one and it'svery slow, BUT amazing edges.
I also have a more green-ish one, but I haven't really spent much time with it. (I gotta do some research about the differences in color and their honing qualities)

I use both naturals and synthetics. I'm hard pressed to make a decision between the two, but for other reasons beside effectiveness, read: the allure of naturals, I like the uniqueness of the natural stones.

My preferred natural progression involves a Coticule, BBW and a Thüringer.
My synthetics is a line-up of Naniwas, followed by a finish on a Coti and/or Thüringer

When I finish on a Thüringer , I first come from a Coticule with already a pretty much shave ready edge.

Both work, but I prefer to finish on a natural stone, for the moment: a Thüringer (dark blue) or a Coticule

Also, remember the "one stone honing" videos, I believe there was one with an Escher



And I gotta agree that these Thüringer hones can glaze over or get ineffective after contamination with oil or grease. They won't do a thing to your razor if that's the case.
I did some experimenting some years ago an used one dry, it worked as long as it wasn't glazed. But after using it dry and later I was using my hone wet again, I noticed it lost pretty much all of it's functionality.
So I took my slurry stone and cleared the surface, ergo why I tend to use these hones with an amount of slurry mostly. Even-though I'm not sure if it would ever glaze over when you only use water, I wouldn't think so, but you never know.

Not to start a whole other debate, but when I received the Coticule from my great grandfather, it was very dirty and I assume it was used with oil, although I can't be certain. I think that might give a smoother finish if you're struggling with a Coticule. I would never use oil on a Thüringer though. Different stones, different ways.

Originally Posted by Phrank

Eschers usually should be very consistent, you can get the odd one out that is an underperformer.

The biggest problem I've heard about and experienced with one I got rid of awhile ago, was a stone that had been contaminated with oil or some other substance. The stone may look fine, but if its been loaded with a heavy oil, its essentially dead. The one I had was terrible, gave it to Val to try out, and he said it produced a terrible edge.

I used to clean my Arkies when the pores were clogged up in a dishwasher. May seem less attractive if your Escher still has its label on. You can also soak it in a solution of bicarbonate of sodium, label facing up and kept dry. Another option might be sanding the toplayer off. Or soaking it in gasoline or paint thinner.

Good morning Gents. I shaved this morning after experimenting last night with going from a JNat to a dark blue Escher. The shave was much better than I'd previously gotten when finishing with an Escher. There was still some irritation, but not nearly as much. I believe I may have been going to the Escher prematurely in the past. Also, this was the first time I'd used the dark blue. I was very surprised at how much harder the stone was than the green varieties I have used. More time with this stone may lead to an even better result.

I think that I would have gotten a great shave (no irritation whatsoever, as opposed to the small amount I got on my neck today) had I used the yellow/green I am most comfortable with. I'm going to continue experimenting. Hopefully, I will discover the Escher edge that I am happiest with. Or maybe i'll never find it and Eschers just aren't for me. In that case, Jimmy's advice will come into play.

On another note, I don't believe any of the stones are compromised by oil. I think this is simply a case of either getting to know my stones, or Escher results not being my preferred edge.