Thread: Jnats - base vs nagura question

Is there a difference to the edge when honing on a jnat base stone vs using the same jnat nagura?

Im wondering why spend extra $$ on a full-size bench stone if the same, or similar, edge can be achieved by using a nagura instead for much less.

Wouldnt one super hard 5++ base stone be all that you really need and then combine with different nagura. Wouldnt that give the most flexibility, at lowest cost, to achieve whatever desired edge you are going for?

is there a need for a jnat base? Or can a hard ark or even a zulu grey be used as the base and then dial in the edge with botan, tenjyou, mejiro, nakayama, ozuku, etc.

Thoughts please?

Bigger stone is just a luxury. If you don't mind honing on say a 1"x3" hard nagura that is flattened then go for it. Small stone like that would be hard to keep slurry on stone and some jnats like very very hard ones do better finishing on slurry. usually the bang for the buck jnats are koppas that you can find for 50-120$ There are some people who sell finishing jnats that are usually around 6" x 2" or so for 120$ or so as well

Also I have heard of some people using nagura on arks but I have no experience in that

Not 100% percent sure what your talking about because its late and im a bit slow to say the least

Yes you need a jnat base .

Its the base that does all the work. It has a specific surface structure that acts with a slurry to give you a bangin edge..

thanks job15. can you reco a base stone that all other nagura can be used with? im assuming something very hard/fine as anything softer would mix with nagura and act counter to intent?

Originally Posted by sloanwinters

Is there a difference to the edge when honing on a jnat base stone vs using the same jnat nagura?

Im wondering why spend extra $$ on a full-size bench stone if the same, or similar, edge can be achieved by using a nagura instead for much less.

Wouldnt one super hard 5++ base stone be all that you really need and then combine with different nagura. Wouldnt that give the most flexibility, at lowest cost, to achieve whatever desired edge you are going for?

is there a need for a jnat base? Or can a hard ark or even a zulu grey be used as the base and then dial in the edge with botan, tenjyou, mejiro, nakayama, ozuku, etc.

Thoughts please?

You need a Jnat base if you will be using nagura and tomonagura from another Jnat. Other types of stones will not work the same way as the slurry break down may not happen the way you want it. It is also very possible you will introduce foreign slurry particles into the mix and that will affect the final edge. That has been tried before and never worked to a satisfactory results IIRC.

I think or at least in my mind the base gives the structure by which the abrasive works to form the steel to that base. I agree that the two abrasives work together and are complimentary. I don't know if you would get a similar result for example could you put slurry on a hard glass surface and get a good edge maybe not but it could be possible that other stones might work. i am not sure which ones might work as base stone jnats have unique hardness to them that are just perfect for the task. Its an interesting thought worth experimenting with if one is inclined.

I have been experiencing great results from a nagura set used on a really hard Chinese 12K (PHIG).

Kelbro, I think that would work well. I also have a PHIG but I use it for occasional touch ups. I have a shoubundi that I use with nagura and a finishing tomonagura to creat slurry. This stone I have owned for almost seven years and it is still teaching me how to hone. I've been called slow, but I'm not retarded.

im pretty i have a barely used phig lying around. not sure why i havent experimented more with it. thanks very for the info!

Using a nagura is fine as long as it’s large enough but the rubbers I use on my JNATS are to small, CKTG does have some Koppa stones once in a while but they sell out quickly, they are much smaller than there big brothers and it’s hit and miss on getting a good one but if you ask them for a razor quality one they usually do a good job of hand picking one.

I currently have a box full of various tomo rubbers that I use on my JNAT finishers and they vary in grit so some generate a pre finish slurry and some generate a fine finish slurry.

A larger JNAT is just more real estate, my favorite finisher is a Nakayama Kiita that’s only about 4” of usable space but it puts on a killer finish, so bigger is not always better