Thread: Toes less keen

my technique is constantly improving and I'm starting to understand subtle nuances of different razors and different stones, films, pasted balsa, lubes

very confident bevels are appropriately set

recent edges are as keen/sharp if not better than a two pro honemeister reference/edges

while hair is popping length of edge, and I'm getting very very fine shaves , I'm finding that

Toes are just slightly less keen, it is subtle but i can tell

this applies to newer SR and vintage all checked for twists/ warping against straight edge, and any smiling, frowns, flaws....

even my beater/ lab rat SR's tend to have softer toes

I'm trying constantly to improve.

any ideas?

troubleshooting tips?

Suggestions?

tools:
range of lapping films on acrylic base
coe whetstone:
medium/bethesda
fine / Dota Creek
polisher/ arkansas grey
norton washita #1
amazon synth 3000/8000 (more like 1500/4000)
.50u, .25u, .1u pasted balsa
paddle strop
hanging strop
wet dry sand paper
granite tile for lapping
technical straight edge
loupe
digital microscope arriving today

Just remember that microscope is going to show you more than you can feel. You need to remember that when using it. I say this but i still try to take out any flaws i see with mine. Put a hair ontop of the blade so you can see how small that microchip really is!

I do not see a good quality 10x loupe, like a Belomo, in your list of equipment. That would allow you to see the edge well and judge where it needs working on by the way it looks. Also missing is a felt marker for marking the bevel and seeing, with a loupe, where the edge may be deficient because there is felt marker left right near the edge.

Two things that bother me about a microscope are that they tend to show much more detail than a loupe and the image needs to be interpreted correctly. Could be a problem if you have no experience interpreting what a loupe will tell you. That said, I have never used a microscope but only seen posted images taken with one. The high magnification images would scare the life out of me if I saw them through 10x loupe. For that reason I have adopted the attitude that if I can't see flaws in the edge or bevel with a loupe then they don't exist but would definitely appear to be there at high magnification. That has not kept me from getting an edge that allows me to do daily 4 pass comfortable shaves.

Personally, rather than getting all those various different grit medias with infinite possible combination of uses I would have opted for a single set synthetic hones to keep the variables down.

A rolling/swooping X stroke should allow you to get at those toes.

Bob

Your progression is not something conducive to advise from others, IMO. In fact, it seems quite subjective.
We often encourage newer honers to stay with common synthetics when asking for honing advise so consistency is there.

The lapping films combined with naturals and synthetics/diamond paste seems an individual choice.
Seems, however, if the toe is not there some work there is needed. How would be up to you.
Best of luck.

Make sure the toe pushes or cuts water/slurry the same as the rest of the edge.

Make sure the toe is as sharp as the rest of the edge at bevel set.

The above posts seem to mention everything, except the magic marker. It can be extremely useful in showing whether or not our stroke is effective for the entire length of the cutting edge. There are many ways to check that your bevel is set. At any point along the edge, if your apex is incomplete the finished edge will lack there. Clearly you are missing you toe at some point in the process. My suspect is an incomplete apex, however it could truly be simply lacking at any one of the hones in the progression.

When do you notice that the toe is less keen? If before stropping, check your stroke, like was said above watch the water and feel for a difference in the feeling of the toe on the hone compared to the rest of the edge. It can be very subtle but you will be surprised how the feedback can tell you a lot about whether the bevel is consistently polished.

If it seems less sharp after stropping but fine before, check your stropping technique. I had a similar problem where the heal and middle of the edge would be sharp and progressively after a few shaves the toes was noticeably behind the rest of the blade. Turned out I wasn’t getting the toe near as much as the rest of the blade while stropping, a slight adjustment to my technique cleared up the issue.

Hope this helps.

Welcome to the forum. I was troubled by constant differences between heel and toe sharpness. Thought I was doing everything right. It was suggested to me that I either lower the hone or raise my elbow to compensate for any heel bias I was putting on the blade......Worked like a champ. Hope this helps.

IMO, stick with synthetic stones until you can hone most blades before trying naturals. This will help you to learn to hone much faster. Not everyone will agree with this. But synthetics are easier to learn.

And yes, the sharpie is a must when learning to hone. And get a colered one. I used red. Easier to see for me.

Originally Posted by Gasman

IMO, stick with synthetic stones until you can hone most blades before trying naturals. This will help you to learn to hone much faster. Not everyone will agree with this. But synthetics are easier to learn.

+7, Your lapping film is a viable synthetic surface and possibly even easier than synthetic stones as there is no lapping, slurry, etc. So no need to buy more stones to learn