Thread: Any general advice for using Arkansas stones?

You could be correct about the un-burnished side taking me back a bit. I should have done a test pass before I went to the burnished side. I'll check on that in the future. I was just kind of guessing the un-burnished would be between the hard ark and burnished black.

When finishing on a synthetic stone, you do so with lite pressure, because they cut faster, finishing with an Ark you will need more pressure to get it to cut. Experiment with the amount of pressure. How your stone is finished, and the quality of the stone will also make a difference.

Different lubricants do not matter all that much, different lube will/can produce different results depending on the stone, stone finish, bevel finish and technique. Kerosene and Diesel work well and were commonly use years ago but are messy and smelly.

The purpose of Lubricant is to carry the swarf and/or provide a cushion between the stone and steel so the tops of the grit polish more than cut. Lube combined with pressure, will deliver different results.

I use Smith’s and Ballistol, because they wash off easily and produces good results. Apply 2-3 drops on a wet stone, add water and drop or two as needed to keep stone wet.

If you use oils, they will dissolve tape, so using tape is difficult. Tape is not an issue with Smith’s and Ballistol. Micro bevels work well with Arks and will reduce the number of laps needed to produce results, you do not need to polish the whole bevel, just add another layer of tape.

Most any razor will work for testing but be careful with thin hollow ground razors and pressure. Too much pressure can flex the edge off the stone. Here a sharpie will quickly tell you how much pressure can be used.

Jelly, you have a lot going on, razor finish, different stones, different stone face prep, pressure, excessive laps, excessive stropping on different strops. It would be difficult to tell which if any of the procedures is making a difference.

Make a good 8k edge that shaves well, then add a layer of tape and produce a micro bevel, (10-20 laps). Magnification will tell you how many laps are needed to produce a full micro bevel. Strop 10-15 laps on leather and shave. Test each stone and find out which stone improves the edge best.

Reduce the variables.

Use them with water. If used with oil pores get gunged up with oil and swarf giving them a glassy surface with minimal cutting power. As Arkies are slow cutters anyway that is the last thing you want. If you happen to have a gunged-up Arkie you can put it in the dishwasher for a fresh surface.

I lapped the black flat a few months ago, the hard ark is new and hasn't seen oil. They should be pretty clean. I'll give the black a good scrubbing just to be sure. Never would have thought of the dishwasher, good idea.

If I use oil on my arkies I always make sure to clean them with hot water and dish soap, only takes a minute. My arkies live in close proximity to my water hones so oil, for me, would be detrimental to my collection. I haven’t had an issue but then again they are never put away with oil still on them.

Progress update:
Got a nice shave this morning after adding extra laps on the burnished side of my black ark. I think I'll add some more laps just to see if it improves, but I'm pretty happy with it now.

I did another 200 or so laps on the burnished black ark using Smith's with a little water. I really like the Smith's with water. Straight Smith's was drying up and getting kind of sticky after 30-40 laps. Adding water thinned it out a bit and the stone felt really smooth. It was not quite oil and not quite water. I followed that up with 50 on canvas and 250 on leather.

The test shave this morning was maybe a little smoother, the whiskers just wiped away. I think this is about as far as this edge will go.

I also started a second blade to check on the un-burnished side of the black ark. I did a test shave after the hard ark and it was pretty similar to the first blade. I did a couple of hundred laps on the un-unburnished side and got another test pass in. It was really similar to the edge off the hard ark, not a step back and not really much of an improvement.

I think I'll take that blade back to the hard ark and then go straight to the burnished side of the black ark. Maybe I can drop the un-burnished side from the progression.

Yea do not use Smith’s straight, on a wet stone use 2-3 drops, add water, keep the stone wet and drop or two of Smith’s as needed. Same for Ballistol.

If you think you are getting all the stone has to offer, after honing one razor, (“The test shave this morning was maybe a little smoother, the whiskers just wiped away. I think this is about as far as this edge will go.”) you will be amazed that you were shaving off that edge a year from now. You are just scratching the surface of the stone’s potential.

If you are not getting a lot of difference from the 600 side and the burnished, your burnished side may not be burnished enough. Or you bevel and edge are not developed fully.

It takes a while to learn a stone, more that just a handful of razors honed.

I mentioned this an another post but here goes. I only dress my Arks as far as 600 Wet/Dry and quickly run a chefs knife over the surface a few times (12 at most) and as soon as my Arks start to become "polished" they go right back to the 600. Polishing your Ark beyond this level, all your doing is removing the stones abrasive properties and you are there for 200+ strokes only to make limited progress if any at all. If your using a well polished/burnished Ark all you are doing is moving the steel around in the same way a Knife Steeling Rod works, you are not actually cutting/removing steel which is the only way to refine the edge, you may as well just strop and forget about the Ark, IMO. Terms such as 'polishing" the edge are very misleading, in order to "polish" your edge to a higher degree one MUST remove steel with progressively finer abrasives, its really that simple. Dont worry too much about pressure, honestly, we all put far too much stock in it and it causes many more issues to arise, just do what feels right. As for lubrication, straight water will work on a very dense Ark such as a Surgical Black or Trans Ark, however, on say a soft Ark it will not carry the swarf away and clog your stone. I personally use propylene glycol USP on my Arks and Cotis. Its non-toxic, 100% water soluble and used throughout the food industry. Add a few drops or your Ark and dilute with water (water soluble) until you get the viscosity you like. Your Ark will tell you when its done and then you can add another drop or two and keep going if your so inclined.

So, because they are natural stones, each may have different performance, but a burnished fine, hard Ark, Translucent or Surgical Black does remove metal, though a very small amount. And that is the goal of a burnished stone face.

To polish at a higher level the stone grit is limited in aggressiveness, by burnishing, flattening the tops of the grit so it cuts a shallower groove. Different lubricants cushion the steel/stone grit contact, so depending on the stone and the amount of pressure will polish the bevel and edge to different degrees.

You can test this by rubbing a soft metal on a burnished stone and see the metal on the stone, which is why they were often used as precious metal testing stones.

Add to this, the refinement of the bevel and edge prior to the finish Ark, plays a large difference in performance, as a burnished or even 600 grit finished stone will not remove as much material as a high grit synthetic stone. So, start with a well finished bevel and edge, near mirror to get the best performance from a burnished Ark. Or add a piece of tape and make a micro bevel.

Way too many variables to generalize based on the performance of your stone and technique.

Bottom line find what works for you and refine it.