Thread: First Honing Experience (Honemeisters please critique)

Soooooo......I've had the stones since Sep 07....but as things go, other things took priority...that and I had enough honed straights (courtesy of JoshEarl and HeavyDuty) that I was not in dire need.

Now, some of the straights have started to feel less than wonderful, so I thought I would give it a shot.

After chatting with JoshEarl and reading the honing FAQ, watching Lynn and HeavyDuty's vids, and reading the Coticle chronicle (wheeew!), I started.

I chose 3 razors:

A new, out-of-the-box generic Solingen
My Wapi
My Dovo Burghof (this was the razor I purchased after FuddEx lost the 2 I sent to Lynn for honing)

Stones:
Norton 4K/8K
Belgian Blue (as an aside, this has always sounded like a dog breed to me..."The sure is a pretty Belgian Blue you have." "Yep, he's 3 years old and is a great retriever...he's good at bringing dubbel and ambers, now he is learning to bring Lambics")...sorry, back to the topic.....
Yellow Cotigura Rubbing stone
Belgian Yellow Coticle
Escher

I started with the new razor and a standard pyramid on the Norton:

3/1
3/1
1/3
1/3
1/3
1/5
1/5
1/10

Always kept the stoned wet, enough that I could see a little "wave" of water pushed in the front of the blade edge as I did each lap. I did laps with the blade perpendicular to the stone.

Then, I moved to the Blue with a slurry for 50 laps;

Then, the blue with just water for 30 laps;

Then, the coticle wet for 30 laps;

Then, the coticle dry for 20 laps.

I read the directions on what was left on my Escher's lable and it recommended a lather. I took a small bit a dishsoap and worked it up into a light foam and did another 20 laps.

Between each progression, I visually checked the edge and did the Thumbpad and thumbnail tests. When I finsihed, the edge was mirror shiny. So, next stop, the bathroom ad a test shave.

I finished the blade on leather, 20 strokes on the Russian, 20 on the Latigo, 20 on the horsehide. I lathered (no towel, no super hot water) and proceded with a WTG stroke. I had 2 days' growth.

The blade removed the whiskers and was moderately smooth, but not on par with blades from JoshEarl or HeavyDuty. I rinsed off and returned to the stones.

I did another 30 laps on the blue (w/ water only), then 20 more on the wet coticle, then 20 on the dry coticle, then 20 on the wet (no soap) Escher. I then did 10 laps on 3.0 pasted paddle, 10 on the 1.0, and 5 on the chrome oxide.

Lathered the other side of my face and did another WTG stroke. Much, much better.

I did the same progression on the Wapi and the Dovo, minus the Norton, as they already had an edge. I have yet to shave with them (ran out of face).

My goal is a smoothly shaving blade, versus scary sharp.

For the Honemeisters, where in this progression can I make imporvements/adjustments?

Difficulties

Keeping count of the laps
Keeping the toe of the blade flat on the stone at the end of the lap
Keeping the spine flat on the stone during the lap pulling towards you....if it came up, I started the lap again.

I have a pile of razors to work on (20+), so all tips/tricks are welcome. I know that each person has their own style and methodology.

On a sid enote, I am selling all my spikes, as I have just have not taken a liking to them. So, they are listed in the B/S/T section. I am sticking with the round end, French, Spanish. I also like wedges and I have a frameback I may need to consult with HeavyDuty on honing (one of the 3 I won in the Great Missouri Razor Auction of 2007).

Greg

Wirebeard,
First off, I don't really consider myself a honemeister, but I do have some experience to share...

The first thing that I think is very important, is that your pyramids on the Norton lead to a perfect bevel, that has both sides of the cutting edge meet in a perfect sharp corner, without any roundness left over from the dull state of the razor. I recommend some way of testing that. A TPT, if you know how to "read" that, or otherwise you could try to shave some hairs of your arm, something that should go completely effortlessly at this stage. Even shaving arm hair slightly above skin level should pop a hair here and there. You could also try to perform a HHT.

Only if the bevel is perfectly sharp, you can proceed to your progression of finishing hones.
Always keep the stroke very light weighted.

50 laps on the blue with a thin slurry. The bare minimum.

A blue with water only is a waste of time. It's just to slow to do anything beneficial to your progression.

Don't use slurry on that coticule. It's a bevel setting hone when used with slurry, and you're already way above the sharpness threshold that a coticule with slurry can offer.

Polish on a coticule with water only. 70 - 100 laps.

I can't comment on the Esher (no experience with that), but you should have a superb shaving edge if you strop about 40 on linen and 40 on leather after the coticule. (more on the leather if you don't want to use the linen)

I strongly advice against experimenting with pasted strops, before you're absolutely confident that you can get a very decent edge from the progression on your hones. Pastes can easily mask the flaws in your honing, but CrO can also do beautiful things for a well honed edge.
The coarser pastes have no place in your progression. (certainly not the 3 micron, about the 1 micron, I'm not sure)

The difficulties you describe will resolve themselves with practise. I think learning to hone, takes regular practice in the beginning, trying to hone one razor each month, will not get you there. (I'm not writing this for you since you have 20+ razors to hone, but for others that may be reading along)

Best of luck,

Bart.

If the blade is shaving with any decent level of comfort, you can start at the wet coticule, no need to go lower since the edge is almost perfect.

The Escher should give you excellent edges, no need for the pastes.

But, if you feel like the stones aren't getting the blade quite as smooth as you'd like, you can jump straight to the CrO (from the coticule or escher), the 3.0 micron is especially unnecessary since the coticule and Escher are finer than that.

Otherwise, you deserve a pat on the back, that's a very good end-result for a first time honing.

And don't worry too much about the lap count, all that matters is that the previous grit scratches are removed, 20-30 laps usually gets it for most stones and more almost never hurts.

Personally with a pretty good razor that just isn't shaving well any more I would have done a much more conservative pyramid with the Norton say around the second 1/3 set then 50 laps on any of the leathers. Then I would have shaved with it and while shaving have used my Escher to bring the blade to perfection through the coarse of the shave.

Don't over complicate things and your edge will be as good as you want it.

Thanks all! I was not sure about the pasted strops and the varying levels...I have used the 1.0 and the 0.5 CrO to tune up razors where the leather wasn't doing its magic any more. I did not use the Norton on any of the blades with an existing bevel, only on the out of the box.

I will adjust my progression with these tips, so i am not "re-doing" a level in the progression.

Thanks! This feedback is why SRP rocks!!!!!!



Greg

Shaved with the Wapi this morning...clean shave, but not "smooth"...didn't feel like it was pulling and it was definitely removing whiskers, but is did not have that "sliding" feel - there was definite effort to the shave.

Ideas?

Wildtim makes a good point.
You might be "overcomplicating" your progression.
Either one of the following are perfectly capable to produce an absolutely shaveready edge:
1. Norton 4/8K - Coticule with water
2. Norton 4/8K - Esher

I would stick with just one of those two options and stay at it till you really know you got the hang of it. Then you can start experimenting with every possible combination, and see what suits you best. (That's actually the fun part of it)

If you previously pasted your razors, than your bevel is likely convexed to some extent. It takes extra work to flatten the bevel again, before the panes can make complete contact with your finishing hone. It is always the very edge that's last in making contact, as soon as the bevel is perfectly flat again. Any finishing before that, and you're waisting your time.

Even a convexed razor that still shaves reasonably well, needs some corrective work to the bevel, before going to the higher grits. Don't be afraid of a few laps on the Norton 4K. Test with the TNT and get to the pyramids after you pass the TNT successfully. (As I pointed out in my first post, the HHT can be put to use at this stage too)

Then polish on either the Coticule or the Esher, but for now, as said, I wouldn't combine them.
Strop light and plenty after that. The resulting edge should be very good.

Hope this helps,

Bart.

Maybe give it a few shaves to even out. If that doesn't work, try just a minimal touch up, ending on the Escher (odds are that it's finer than your Coticule), shave, then try CrO if it's still not how you want it.

But I hate to say that it could just be the Wapi. I have many good shavers but no matter what I do, some are always slightly inferior to others. I figure it has to do with the steel and how it was treated by the manufacturer, at which point no amount of care on the stones will make up the difference.

It sounds to me like you are very close to really having it figured out. I too prefer a comfortable "smooth" blade over the "scary" sharp.Its my opinion that the difference between the two is the scary sharp blade has the proper bevel geometry,but still has micro serrations-ie. teeth.I think the amount of teeth you actually leave on the blade is what generates the "comfort".

Provided you finish polishing the blade and DO NOT alter the bevel geometry you'll get a good shave.Some may need more "teeth" others with a coarse beard,like myself,do better with a smoother blade. At least that is how I have found it to be.

I prefer the Shapton Glass hone and pyramid between my 8000 and 16000 and then go directly to a leather strop.When I used different coticules I got good results-but the amount of time I spent finishing the blade was MUCH more than with the aggressive Shapton.

Regardless of how you smooth out the blade,technique is critical-even if you lose track of the number of strokes-provided you don't change the bevel-that is make it convex or simply blunting it-you WILL eventually get the blade to cut your beard and NOT grate your face into hamburger. The goal is the same-there are just a myriad of ways to get there. Best of Luck.

Thanks all! More experimentation in the future!