Thread: Advice for killer edge on friodur

My Friodur shaves good after some seriously challenging honing sessions.I actually set a new bevel on it, and progressed from my norton 4000/8000 to my shapton 16k.I finished with chromium on cotton.This is my only stainless, and I'm aware of the extra work needed.But I have gotten superb results on many other razors with this progression.I have gone back and forth between chrom ox and 16k several times.I have also stropped the heck out of it.It just wount take that killer edge!!.I'm thinking mabe some diamond pastes.0,5? 0,25? never tried them... Would it be possible to go from shapton16k to 0,25, or should I also include the 0,5.?
And what would be the best medium for it? Any good advice?

Thanks Kristoffer.

Hi Kristoffer, Friodurs can be very frustrating. I have experiment with many of them that were sent to me for honing. If I had one that would not cooperate, I would start taping the spine. It seems like it an average of three or four layers of 3M 1700 electrical tape will give an angle that the blade likes. It has been my experience that the stainless steel blades tend to be softer then carbon steel blades. I would tape at the 4000 grit level then tape all the way through 12000, 16000, to 0.5µ to 0.25µ diamond paste on a leather bench strop. I would then remove the tape and strop on a horsehide hanging strop. If it looked good under the microscope after the last stropping, it has usually been a good durable edge. That only stainless steel I have had hold an edge as long as a carbon steel razor has been AT34. I do have a Dovo SS that I use at my gym that will also hold its edge for a longtime; however, it is an anomaly.

Stainless softer than carbon?? I tought it was the opposite? The Friodur sure needs about twice the usual laps I normaly use. And three or four layers of tape all the way? Ok if you say so, I'll give it a try, you have a lot more honing exp. than me for sure.:-) seems alot tough....
Thanks Ken

I can only assume that Ken meant that the ideal angle of the bevel on a stainless blade is softer than the angle on a carbon blade.

Originally Posted by BigBubba

I can only assume that Ken meant that the ideal angle of the bevel on a stainless blade is softer than the angle on a carbon blade.

Is there such a thing as a soft angle?

Originally Posted by KristofferBodvin

Is there such a thing as a soft angle?

It's the opposite of a hard line.

Originally Posted by BigBubba

I can only assume that Ken meant that the ideal angle of the bevel on a stainless blade is softer than the angle on a carbon blade.

Nope, I mean a steeper angle on the edge and I find as a rule SS softer then quality carbon steel. Glen (gssixgun) has the right of it. I spend more time on the finer grits with SS. Tim Zowada did a great study about taping the spine and how much it changes the angle. The Friodurs that I have had to wrestle with have been the large 7/8 or 8/8. A layer of tape changes the angle very little on a wide blade. One layer of tape on a 5/8 is comparable to about three layers on a lager blade because of the distance between the edge and the spine. The wider the blade the less effect of tape. The first part of this month, I did a Friodur for a member was a real problem child for him. I honed it with four layers of tape and I shaved with it for a week. It shaved very well all week long. Under the microscope showed that it was holding a very good edge. I was pleased that it also gave a comfortable shave. SS tends to give me a less then comfortable shave compared to my carbon steel blades. The Friodurs will eventually work, you just have to figure out what will take to get it right.

FWIW, I bought a 7/8 Friodur from Tstebins months ago. It was one of the sharpest razors I have ever encountered. I PMed him and asked him what he had used to sharpen it and he said it had come to him as it was from Japan and he didn't know who sharpened it or how they went about it.

I would bet it ended up on diamond paste or spray. I have an Ellis ATS 34 that I couldn't get to the level of sharpness I wanted and the same with a TI Damascus. I went through the Shapton pros from 1K to 15k and then hit them on the felt strop from Lynn with the diamond spray and they were golden.

Anyway the point is that the Friodur has the potential and I am sure you will get it there.

Hmmmm.... I also thought that stainless was harder, and more brittle than regular carbon steel.

Originally Posted by KristofferBodvin

Stainless softer than carbon?? I tought it was the opposite?

Some carbon steel razors are pretty soft, and some are extremely hard. But stainless razors can't be made quite as hard as the best carbon steel razors. They seem harder than they really are because chromium promotes carbide formation in the steel, and carbides are very abrasion-resistant. Also because stainless is ductile and tends to smear around instead of scraping off nicely.

IME stainless tends to need more time on the finer grit hones, and I also think that stainless responds very well to a pasted strop since the flexible surface of the pasted strop is capable of just honing around the carbides instead of having to laborously grind them down.