Thread: Setting the bevel basics

O.K., my only excuse is I am BRAND-new to this.

I had a couple of small dings (largest about halfway through the bevel, seen at 60X) on a fifteen-shave old Bismarck. Still don't know how they happend, but I think maybe my angle was too steep, and my beard is pretty coarse.

So I reviewed Lynn's DVD. At one point he states he has a ding (seen with naked eye) he is going to remove with some circles on a Norton 4K. He does two sets of 20 circles (both sides), looks at the blade, declares all is well, and startes a pyramid.

I tried this. After five sets of 20, there was no change I could see. Also, oddly, I could see none of the tell-tale particles of steel that were obvious on his stone after just a couple of circles.

So I dropped down to the 1K. Same result. No change in the blade after five sets of 20, nothing in the water I could see.

So this is where I screwed up. I started doing circles on the 220K It took at least another 5X 20 to get the largest ding out, but when I looked at the rest of the edge, it looked like a microscopic mouse had been nibbling away at it. Jagged, peaks, valleys, etc., again viewed at 60X The edge had been compromised in large areas, again roughly halfway up the bevel in the worst areas.

I called Lynn's shop and Don was extremely kind and helpful. He advised going back to the 4K for a couple more sets of circles, then a couple of pyramids and on up through the 12K, pastes, strop, shave test, and repeat as necessary.

Having spent already a lot of time on the 4K doing circles without seeing ANY results, I'm doubtful that this will resolve my problem. I recognize that Don knows more about the process than I ever will, but my experience tells me that I will be spending hours and hours repeating this process before I get a good edge. I am, of course, willing to do it this way is it is the best way to do it, but my inclination is to start on the 1K and do circles until I've eliminated most of the roughness on micro exam, and getting a good TNT, then moving up the grit hierarchy. Of course, thinking this way (circles on a rougher stone is the answer!) is what got me into trouble the first time.

So my question is: Is there anything wrong with doing circles on the 1K? Looking through the stickys and other info here and on B&B, it seems most folks set bevels doing regular honing strokes on the 1K OR circles on the 4K. Again, I will be happy to do either if that is what I should do. Are circles on the 1K an option though? Again, I've looked at honing advice on several posts and stickys, and maybe I'm not reading careefully enough or something, but I'm not sure if this is an option.

Any suggestions gratefully received.

I would definitely spend a little time on the 1k and save, not only some time, but having to lap your 4k prematurely because you were grinding a new bevel on it. Gently, 20 circles at a time on each side, check the edge, repeat if necessary.

X

Originally Posted by pcb01

O.K., my only excuse is I am BRAND-new to this.

I had a couple of small dings (largest about halfway through the bevel, seen at 60X) on a fifteen-shave old Bismarck. Still don't know how they happend, but I think maybe my angle was too steep, and my beard is pretty coarse.

I think this is where the problem is. I don't know how coarse your beard is, but I doublt anyone's beard is tough enough, or technique bad enough to ding an edge.

As you discovered, less is more in honing. The peaks and valleys are probably from the coarse scratch pattern of the 220, rather than your technique. Doing circles on the 1k or lower grits is for dings you can see with the naked eye. I would do the circles until it is almost gone, then x strokes to even out the hone wear, then go to the next higner grit to set the bevel until the ding is completely gone. Also, especially if I do circles below 1K, I would tape the spine to avoid too much (and uneven) spine wear.

Is your (i think this is what you are describing) microchip giving you a harsh shave? If not, I personally would have left it alone. At most, I'd redo the bevel with x strokes on the 1K until the edge is even, and rehone from there.

i agree that circles on the 1k shouldn't be a problem. i have done them on mine don't find it to be overly aggressive. that being said you should check it often with the mag, but it seems like you know that

This post by Joed here is about as good a tutorial as I have seen. Take a look and follow it and you can't go wrong IMO.

In general you have to double the grit rate with each honing step.
220 is extremely rough for a straight razor. 320 is the lowest grit I ever use on a razor, and only when I need to remove A LOT of steel.
If the ding in you razor is gone, it would be best to step up to 500 grit or so and hone out all 220 marks. Next 1K, 2K, 4K, 8K.
You can skip a step, at the cost of additional honing time: 220 - 1000 - 4000, etc... It takes longer than not skipping steps.
If you need to skip a step, rely on circles or diagonal back and forth honing with some pressure to speed up the process. Always finish on a hone with normal low pressure "flipping" strokes, before going to the next hone.

Bart.

The 220 is a definite cutter and works well to remove larger chips. Sometimes it still can take a ton of circles to get them out, so many on occasion that I will use tape to not really flatten out a spine. The serrations you see at this point under the scope are normal. If you use a thumb pad test here and get that sticky sharp feeling, then you are ready usually for the 1K. The 1K is the workhorse for setting bevels for me. After the 220K, I normally on need up to 80 circles on the 1K, followed by 10-20 X strokes to properly shave my bevel. At this point also, the serrations should almost or be gone under the microscope and you should have a nice straight edge.

Lynn