Thread: Microscope Examination

I have found using a 16x loupe good for troubleshooting. I had two older razors that cut me slightly when using the blade tip. Looking at 16x, I could see that the blade was chipped away slightly in that area. Invisible to the naked eye.

I don't find magnification any help for determining whether a razor is honed to perfection. And none of my razors has a uniformly deep edge. They all have a longer, shallower, edge towards the tips and a steeper, shorter edge in the middle.

Bob

!6x wouldn't tell you much about the quality of the hone. At 100x a razor that shaves OK has a jagged edge. 60x it's not as bad. If you can get it to look smooth at 60x it'll be a much better. I have gotten edges to look quite smooth at 100x but it's a painstaking process and it doesn't seem to make a difference.

When I get a razor that feels really sharp in the barber's test, it'll look smooth at 60x. That's how I taught myself the test. That, and practicing with a fresh razor blade.

Originally Posted by Bob Cross

I have found using a 16x loupe good for troubleshooting. I had two older razors that cut me slightly when using the blade tip. Looking at 16x, I could see that the blade was chipped away slightly in that area. Invisible to the naked eye.

I don't find magnification any help for determining whether a razor is honed to perfection. And none of my razors has a uniformly deep edge. They all have a longer, shallower, edge towards the tips and a steeper, shorter edge in the middle.

Bob

Originally Posted by adjustme69

I was wondering if any of you use a microscope when honing your razors to examine the bevel and the edge as you go? Can you also share what you are seeing? I use a 20x40x80 that I got on ebay and it's a gas to see the bevel gettting corrected and the striations tightening during the honing and finishing process. You can really see the microscopic chipping and overhoning as well. I posted a similar one to this in the Yahoo group. Thanks guys. Lynn

Lynn,

I got one of those Radio Shack microscopes yesterday and am beginning to use it. What I noticed last night when working on one of my razors was that some of the edge looks bright and shiny and others parts don't. I am attempting to get an idea of what right looks like. I definately can see changes to the blade and after I got through the thumb test told me that what I was seeing was sharp. However the shave this morning was good but not great. Right now I am using the 100 power. I have reviewed the pictures on this web site of magnification along with those on the Yahoo site. But in some cases the pictures don't tell me much if I don't know what to look for. Should the edge look shiny or not? Should I be able to see all the scratch patterns facing the same direction. Guess I just need some sage advice.

jmsbcknr

Originally Posted by Durf

I just posted some microscope photos under Durfee that show some interesting features of various blades; a blade damaged by misuse, an ebay special that will never be sharpenable due to widespread micropitting, a TI that has been over .5 micron paste a bunch of times, compared to one that was honed by a member and only stropped without paste since, and one of the club razors after its first honing. Next, I think I'll zoom in on my Norton hone and see what I can see.

Let me know if you'd like me to look at anything else. I took some very good measurements but you can't read them on the photos because of the resolution loss. The hair is about 75 microns = 3 mils thick.

I appreciate the pictures however I do not know what "right" looks like. I can see the obvious things like pitting and such. But what does "super sharp" look like. That is my goal to see what I am feeling with my thumb as super sharp and what it looks like under the scope. Just a question. If I looked at a feather blade, new out of the box, would that show me what super sharp looks like?

jmsbcknr

Originally Posted by Chaaaz

Already answered in the Yahoo group, Lynn, but thought I would add a bit here. The Radioshack 60X - 100X has all the power I need at a good price, and I learned to control it very quickly.

I usually inspect the edges at 6oX first, and If I see any major imperfections, I try to correct those. Once the edge looks good to me at 60X, I increase the power halfway, about to 80X-ish, and recheck. I do any additional honing there, too. Final inspection is at 100X, and usually will pick-up minor edge issues.

If I get an edge looking good to me at 100X, it is usually ready for stropping and shaving. I use some pastes now, after the stones, and the scope actually shows some improvements there, as well!

I would think that at least for the $10 RS Scope, every straight shaver should have one!


Best - (longing for a tri-occular table model microscope!)

Chaaz

I have one of the RS microscopes also. Though I can see the edge on my razors at 60, 80, 100X I am not sure what I am looking for that would tell me that the razor is super sharp. What does super sharp look like? Do you have any pictures of what that might look like so I can attempt to get there?

jmsbcknr

Excellent idea! But don't expect to match it. My improvement in honing was delayed quite a bit because I was trying to get my razors to shave like a Feather. I thought I was doing something wrong because my razors were never as good. Guess what? The razors from the best honemeisters aren't as good!

The final test is shaving, regardless of what any other test tells you. I trained my thumb by trying to get as close as I could to a fresh razor blade. I also used the microscope, and there's a connection between the quality of the shave and how smooth the blade edge is. You can also see the difference that stroping makes (with and without paste). It seems to cause the scratch lines to fade.

Originally Posted by jmsbcknr

If I looked at a feather blade, new out of the box, would that show me what super sharp looks like?

jmsbcknr

What I always try to look for through the microscope is to see if the edge is even in distribution across the razor. Next I want to make sure that the striations are tight and in most cases they do look darker through the microscope. I also try to make sure no shading up toward the edge and no micro chips near the edge. These usually indicate overhoning and the chips indicate that even if the razor is shaving sharp, it usually won't be as comfy as it should be. I don't try to compare my feather because even though the feather is a super shaver, I find it less for giving and a totally different experience than my regular straight razors. Keep us posted on your progress. Lynn

I agree with Lynn, I look for a uniformity of evenness in the very , cutting, edge. A scratch pattern that all goes the same direction. A shine that is the same all along the bevel. The color of the bevel should be the same right up to the edge and the razor "MUST!" pass the hanging hair test after the 8000 stone or else it is not ready for a shave test. The scope will not tell you if the razor is shave ready. It will only reveal problems that need to be taken care of. Only the thumb test or the hanging hair test will tell you if the razor is ready for a shave test. The major thing we all have to learn is that we will seldom get the razor perfect on the first honing. If we do, it just pure dumb luck.

Just my two cents,

It's instructive to see what each type of honing and stropping does. I used the scope to help me learn the thumb test. I could feel the edge forming and then see it becoming more even. One thing I noticed is that a blade will pass the thumb test before it looks perfectly even or flat in the scope. Every time I check a blade that shaves especially well I find that it looks flat at 60x. A fresh razor blade also looks just about perfectly flat at 60x. So, I assume that a perfectly even edge would be ready for the shave test.

I noticed that as I moved to finer pasted strops the scratch pattern becomes finer and leather stropping makes the scratches fade. So, it seems that smoothing out the scratch lines improves the quality of the edge.

Originally Posted by randydance062449

The scope will not tell you if the razor is shave ready. It will only reveal problems that need to be taken care of. Only the thumb test or the hanging hair test will tell you if the razor is ready for a shave test. The major thing we all have to learn is that we will seldom get the razor perfect on the first honing. If we do, it just pure dumb luck.

Just my two cents,

Originally Posted by jmsbcknr

Chaaz

I have one of the RS microscopes also. Though I can see the edge on my razors at 60, 80, 100X I am not sure what I am looking for that would tell me that the razor is super sharp. What does super sharp look like? Do you have any pictures of what that might look like so I can attempt to get there?

jmsbcknr

If you see little caterpillar-like thingies crawling around, crank down the power a bit ....