Thread: Help with fine tuning.....

Hi Barry,

Sorry didn't mean to confuse you. I will have a chance to check out that thread and try and fix the confusion tonight.

I won't even discuss the x pattern and luckily Sham has taken that one on. Four or five years ago I would have taken the time to explain that one, but I'm done with the persuasive writing. As Sham has said "it works". Also, be a little willing to think outside the box. Just because we say an "X pattern" doesn't mean it has to replicate an X exactly. It can be more vertical or more elogated. I would almost say that my x pattern is more like pulling the razor downward and flipping then running the blade lengthwise down the hone.

Now to solve your problem, and without getting too advanced, I'm going to just be truthful with you. The concentration of contact isn't on the hone at all. It is under the scales and created by the pinky. Hold the shank between index finger and thumb, place your pinky under the razors scales and lift slightly. Now the razor can not lift off the hone and remains flat while moving down the hone. If there is any point of contact pressure on the blade it'll get screwed up.

I'll reply again tonight, late. You can PM me anytime you want. We can talk on the phone or whatever. Feel free to call me on any posts that confuse you. Lets agree that we won't dig up any posts from say, over 5 years ago though, because my views on honing changed a little with practice.

Ahhh . . . I just checked out that thread. It is from a little while back ('06). Can you send me a PM and tell me where I confused you? There is a big difference sometimes in generic threads that I started and when I reply to an individual. They often have differing purposes. Again, sorry for the confusion.

Alan

Originally Posted by AFDavis11

Hi Barry,

...........I won't even discuss the x pattern and luckily Sham has taken that one on. Four or five years ago I would have taken the time to explain that one, but I'm done with the persuasive writing

................ Lets agree that we won't dig up any posts from say, over 5 years ago though, because my views on honing changed a little with practice.

Alan,

Thanks for the reply. I understand the X pattern works..... Just have had problems with the heel coming off the stone before it gets enough honing and the toe gets sharp first.

I am sure patriarchs like yourself get tired of telling newbies things that have been repeated over and over. I REALLY have tried to search the archives as much as possible before jumping in here. I have seen the shift and progression in technology and tools. Just trying to filter out the theory to make it work for me.

My confusion is this>> Trying to understand the place for scratches as it relates to durability and cutting teeth versus polish versus sharpness and aggressive edge. I know there is all kinds of principles involved.

At the moment Sham (hi_bud_gl_) has been helping me over the phone. He has been a wonderful help. I understand words are much easier than tying so I will shoot you a PM with my number and you can call if you like.....

Thanks a million,

Barry

Originally Posted by bjanzen

Alan,

Thanks for the reply. I understand the X pattern works..... Just have had problems with the heel coming off the stone before it gets enough honing and the toe gets sharp first.



Barry

Have you tried using a maker on the edge to see where you need extra work honing? This can help you adjust your angle to hone the whole edge more consistently.

Originally Posted by Disburden

Have you tried using a maker on the edge to see where you need extra work honing? This can help you adjust your angle to hone the whole edge more consistently.

I haven't used a marker.... I have been using a microscope extensively and watch the edge with back lighting to see the waves or lack there of as it gets sharper.

Originally Posted by bjanzen

Alan,

Thanks for the reply. I understand the X pattern works..... Just have had problems with the heel coming off the stone before it gets enough honing and the toe gets sharp first.

I am sure patriarchs like yourself get tired of telling newbies things that have been repeated over and over. I REALLY have tried to search the archives as much as possible before jumping in here. I have seen the shift and progression in technology and tools. Just trying to filter out the theory to make it work for me.

My confusion is this>> Trying to understand the place for scratches as it relates to durability and cutting teeth versus polish versus sharpness and aggressive edge. I know there is all kinds of principles involved.

At the moment Sham (hi_bud_gl_) has been helping me over the phone. He has been a wonderful help. I understand words are much easier than tying so I will shoot you a PM with my number and you can call if you like.....

Thanks a million,

Barry

Edges are edges I like to think. I can get a good shaving from a plane iron sharpened on 1000 shapton, but it does not stay sharp as long as when sharpened to 8k. Similarly a razor polished on Asagi does not especially loose its "tooth"

An edge that does not hold and cut the hair is just dull- no matter how many laps it has seen.

Personally I have never sharpened more than one razor at a time. I understand guys with many razors that need done, but for learning/personal use; too much on the table cannot help. Seems like eventually you start thinking about the next one, not the one you're on-comparing, wondering.

If you are getting close to Lynn's sharpness on the rocks you may be loosing it on the strop.

[QUOTE=kevint;503141.............If you are getting close to Lynn's sharpness on the rocks you may be loosing it on the strop.[/QUOTE]

I have talked to two wonderful gentleman on the phone this week. I have come to some conclusions.

1. I can get a keen edge with diamond paste but but it doesn't hold up very long.

2. My stroke still isn't the best. Need to get a perfectly smooth stroke to achieve a great edge.

3. My stropping may be part of it, but I doubt it. None the less, I am trying to shave off the 8k to determine what is honing and what is stropping errors.

Was told last night that one blunder out of 50 strokes will affect the edge. That was a revelation to me. When sharpening a plane blade, I do one side at a time and flip it ater ten strokes or so. Are fragile razor needs CONSISTENCY along the entire edge and stroke for the whole process. For a perfectionist.....that is HARD!

Barry

Originally Posted by bjanzen

3. My stropping may be part of it, but I doubt it. None the less, I am trying to shave off the 8k to determine what is honing and what is stropping errors.
Barry

Well,

I just shaved with the razor that I practiced with last night. I had done many practice laps on the 8k with some 4k backhoning thrown in to keep from edge deteriation.

I shaved without any stropping. It cut nicely.... but after 50 laps on the leather, it was much smoother and cut just as well if not better. Shave was on par with my best razor from last week.

I am making progress here...... Learning the SMOOTH and CONSISTENT honing stroke is where it is at for me.

Now for some good muscle memory from practice

Thanks for all the help..... Barry