Thread: Hone/Strop Advice needed for first setup!

Originally Posted by Patches

Thanks for clearing that up shooter, especially the info about the tests, that helps quite a bit. I didn't mean to sound like I thought honing would be easy though, just doable with some practice and some patience.

this is correct but still requires a bunch of stones

How often does a razor need to be honed (on average) once sharp? (so when would buying a hone become necessary. Or is using a paste as would come with the Filly a viable way to extend time between hones?)

you need to hone the razor when touching up on pasted strop does not refresh the edge any more.

So this means that even the Norton stone will require lapping right off the bat? Thats something I hadn't considered, thanks for pointing that out.

yes any stone(bar diamond stones) before use has to be lapped.

If straight shaving is something you want to do, get one honed by a pro. I found when first starting that even with a perfectly sharp razor it is very uncomfortable until I started to get my angle and pressure down. I can see problems coming when you add frustration to that by trying to get a sharp razor. I was in the same boat pretty much, I thought how hard can it be to sharpen a razor all one has to do is keep it flat on the hones, well take my advice it is harder than it appears. I have honed tons of knives in the past as well and I have yet to get one of my practice blades to the level of shaving, they are sharp as hell just not sharp enough to shave whiskers all along the blade. There are a few honers on here that every once in a while offer a free hone all you have to do is pay for shipping both ways, maybe you'll get lucky and one of them will feel enough pitty for your face to help you out. I am not trying to say you WONT be able to do it but if starting out you want as comfortable of shave as possible as not to turn you off from straight shaving all together get one professionally honed, IMO.

Patches,

You definitely are ahead of the game if you are sharpening your own knives, although you will need finer hones than those used for kitchen knives. And they will need to be flatter, hence the comments on lapping the hones.

The lapping can be done fairly cheaply such as with wet-or-dry sandpaper and a piece of plate glass. I've read of stone tiles being used and this may be just fine; regardless, your substrate for the paper must be flat. Lap with a figure 8 motion and frequently swap ends on the lapped object to balance the forces exerted by your hand. Keep every thing as wet as possible to remove swarf. If you find you love the processes then you can get diamond charged lapping plates.

My personal minimal approach to honing started with a Norton 4k/8k combo and a coticule/Belgian blue natural combo, a cheap but flat granite surface plate, and some wet-or-dry 320 and 600 grit papers. I made a paddle strop and charged it with the Thiers Issard paste for finishing. Since I've been sharpening edged tools all my life, I figured I was home free.

But I wasn't; however, the adventures with honing my first razor weren't a total bust either. I didn't get the razor shaving sharp, but I didn't ruin the edge either. I made the trek from lap it/them to 4k to 8k to some forth and back via the pyramid technique to the coticule with water only, then I watched Lynn's video again which gave me some additional tips. Taking those tips to heart and easing up on the pressure and keeping everything nice and wet eventually got me to an edge I could shave with. My favorite razor now is one which I honed myself.

Oh yes, and there were the demos from my local mentor Randy, known hereabouts as Randydance. These were also of great help.

Good luck (we all started out from a place real close to where you are - and look how well things are working for us now )

Originally Posted by Patches

$120? Does that mean that more is required beyond the Norton 4k/8k (which seems to run from $70 to $80) for this particular job? Does that include a strop? I already have a 1k stone on hand that I use for knives if thats any consideration.

yeah you'll need 1k stone, i didn't realize you already have one.

Originally Posted by Bruce

Patches,

You definitely are ahead of the game if you are sharpening your own knives, although you will need finer hones than those used for kitchen knives. And they will need to be flatter, hence the comments on lapping the hones.

I use the same progression up to 10k as I use for my knives its the same stones: Naniwa Superstone and chosera.
For razors you need to go to much higher grits than with knives.
When sharpening knives you have to lap the stones more often that when you sharpen razors.

Ok, so considering all the advice I've been given I've decided I'd better just send off one of the razors to be honed then work out whether or not I'd like to make the investment to learn to hone myself. Any suggestions for a someone to hone near(ish) to the LA area? I suppose any continental US one will work just as well though, as far as shipping goes.

This is my plan of action as far as I can figure it out with a few questions:

- Send razor off for honing

- Purchase strop (likely the TM Heirloom with a practice, though he seems to have checked out til after the new year, though I doubt I'll be able to get a razor back before then anyhow. Looks like there are some cheap Illinois strops on ebay as well, I've heard good things about those but would anyone recommend them for a starter strop?)

- Purchase paste for practice strop around the time I graduate to the real strop (hopefully the timing works out well enough. Can you go a decent while before using a pasted strop/honing is necessary like I'm assuming here? Just assuming several weeks to a month, hopefully)

- Purchase barber hone/chinese water stone/fine hone for touch ups on razor around or before the time it becomes necessary

- Purchase Norton 4k/8k or similar along with other necessary items TBD to begin learning to hone with second razor (would touching up on the Norton possibly replace the finer barber hone/etc. or are both necessary for touching up a shave ready razor?)

Does that sound about right? Please let me know what you guys think, and thank you for all the advice/guidance so far, its been really helpful and has certainly saved me time, money and possible frustration.

-Patrick

I can give a little advice on the strop. I bought the Illinois 827 strop. It is a nice strop and has a linen side to it as well. Some of the more experienced members use this strop and recommend it. It will cost around 40.

Stropping has proved to be a hard task. It is much harder than it looks.

Originally Posted by Patches

Any suggestions for a someone to hone near(ish) to the LA area?

I do not know of a honer in the Louisiana area.

You should try the member map here : http://straightrazorpalace.com/vbgooglemapme.php

You may also consider adding your location to your profile. Having some in person help with shaving, stropping, blade maintenance, honing, etc. is invaluable. The BEST money you could spend is buying a drink for those experienced to meet with you in your area to help you get started.

Hey Patches

Im new to SE saving too. . .I bought a razor here on SRP and it was "pro-honed". . .however I also bought a dovo shavette prior and found that even the honed razor needed a bit of stropping to even get close to the shavette shave. In my eyes purchasing a shavette ($30) to get a good idea of what sharp really is would give you a basis for honing and stropping. . .just an idea.

Oh. . .I also bought Lynns video on SE shaving and there is a large section in there on honing. . .way, way more than what I found online.

Good luck!

Max is in LV which I think should be a one day post times, but LA to me (middle of NY) is 2 days, so it's not a dramatic difference anywhere in US.
The illinois strops are good, they are real strops and work very well. Don't have the luxury look and feel of the tony's, or srd's strops though.

I think getting one of your razors honed is definitely the way to start. I wouldn't worry about honing at this point. Concentrate on learning to shave and strop and by the time your razor needs a touch up you'll have had more time to consider what to do, as there are many many options.