Thread: Not getting a sharp edge

I shave with a razor I honed myself, but the edge is not that sharp. It won't pass the HHT (I've gotten it to pop a hair lowered onto it aggressively, but it mostly lets them slide off without biting and cutting) and the edge is extremely shiny but full of visible scratches (mind you, what's visible to me is visible to you... with at least 30x magnification; I don't use anything less than 50x because the lens interferes with my vision, and I don't own ANY lenses at the moment so it's moot).

I'm thinking instead of constantly trying to rehone my Dovo, I'll just buy a $15 Gold Dollar 208 and maul that bad boy up. Besides, it'll give me a shot at finding/fixing defects; and it's a cheap razor made of decent steel, not an expensive razor made of awesome German or Swedish steel, so I can tear it up or have fun cutting a spike point onto it. I have a couple Pakistani specials, but ... they don't seem to take an edge at all, the steel flakes, the edge feels like it's made of paper.

Think the issue might be too much pressure on the 4k? I eased up honing on the 8k, but it hasn't smoothed out the edge. It looks like I have some pretty deep scratches, possibly from setting the bevel at 4k, with maybe too much pressure. I don't know.

The real question is does the razor shave well? Your opening line says you shave with this razor, so is it a close and comfortable shave? Is there any pulling or irritation?

The only real test is the shave test, and if it shaves good then it is good..!

The HHT does raise a fair few questions here, due to its ambiguous results. Ambiguous until you have it calibrated for your hair I mean.

To give an example, I have a Boker Edelweisse that I got from SRD and was honed by Lynn so I KNOW I have a sharp edge. This razor will pass the HHT about 60% of the time for me with my hair, every time for my dad and never for a mate of mine. One razor and three different results, but I'll tell you now, that razor is a smooth shaver..!

So dont sit there and keep honing the razor looking for the HHT to be passed, as all you risk is overhoning the razor and you'll definately put more wear on the bevel and spine (assuming you dont use tape!).

Alot of the razors from the Pakistani region have inconsistent steel and many will not take a good edge. If you search on the makers names you'll find loads of information from the pro's who've all tried to hone them and the problems they encountered.

The pressure on the razor should only be the weight of the razor on the hone. When you're bevel setting you might rest the weight of your finger on the blade as well, but thats the most pressure you'll ever need unless you're doing major edge repair work.

Good luck and keep us posted!

Your idea of getting a cheaper razor to practice with is a
good one, but you really should get your Dovo honed by
a honemeister as well so you have a point of comparison
for `sharp'.

If you think you might be using too much pressure, you
probably are. Try honing with no pressure at all on
the 4k for a few strokes (10-20) and then back up to the
8k with absolutely the lightest touch possible. You may
also choose consult the wiki for a pyramid here.



- Scott

Originally Posted by Stubear

The real question is does the razor shave well? Your opening line says you shave with this razor, so is it a close and comfortable shave? Is there any pulling or irritation?

It could be sharper. A Feather AC gets me a closer shave, but it never did until I started using my self-honed Dovo (oddly, a real straight that was fresh off the Norton 8k with bad honing technique quickly cleaned up my technique). In fact, a Feather AC nearly effortlessly gets me a better shave; it just does so with quite a lot of irritation. Before I started using my Dovo I just cut myself to hell with the Feather haha...

The Dovo does get me a 1 pass DFS. It's just not nearly as close to the Feather, which is giving me 1 pass near BBS. Also as I said, the edge looks like it's seen low-grit sandpaper. There's plenty of scratches, it doesn't look like a smooth surface at all save for the mirror polish the C12k left on it. Using metal polish on brushed steel without lapping it with 1000-1500 grit sandpaper will just get you shiny brushed steel, you know? It's like that.

Originally Posted by Stubear

The HHT does raise a fair few questions here, due to its ambiguous results. Ambiguous until you have it calibrated for your hair I mean.

The Feather AC and various DE blades pass HHT.

Originally Posted by Stubear

So dont sit there and keep honing the razor looking for the HHT to be passed, as all you risk is overhoning the razor and you'll definately put more wear on the bevel and spine (assuming you dont use tape!).

Yeah hence why I'm thinking I'll buy a Gold Dollar or something. Something I can get for under $20 that's nowhere near shave ready and doesn't need to be descaled/sanded/polished, and no great loss if I tear it up.

Originally Posted by Stubear

Alot of the razors from the Pakistani region have inconsistent steel and many will not take a good edge.

Yeah, the steel on a Gold Dollar is at least decent. Those Pakistani razors feel like paper to me though, or Mica...

Originally Posted by Stubear

The pressure on the razor should only be the weight of the razor on the hone. When you're bevel setting you might rest the weight of your finger on the blade as well, but thats the most pressure you'll ever need unless you're doing major edge repair work.

So should I go back to the Norton 4000 and glide it lightly?

I have numbers of junk razors, and would give you one. Their metal is better than the Gold Dollar. Their problems range from bad scales to bad rust in spots on the blade. The Gold Dollar will do. But, if you're buying, why not go free?

PM me for my address if interested/

I would take Larry up on his offer. It is well worth it

This is just an opinion of mine but I think getting a well honed razor from someone like Lynn or another well known member is necessary when learning how to use a straight. Jumping right in with honing and a razor you're trying to sharpen yourself is a set up for failure and hopefully not a cut on your face. It seems you've already moved past the ignoring honing thing though...


Honing is rather simple in theory, magnification is something I would never hone without, it's helped me get awesome edges. I wouldn't have had that type of success without it. Since your edge may be off from honing incorrectly, I would breadknife it on the bottom of a juice glass (Run the edge without ANY pressure) so you can start again on clean steel.

You can look at the bevel through a microscope and see if you're honing a bevel all the way up the edge on booth sides on a low grit stone like a 1K. These scopes are pocket size and you can get them at radioshack or Amazon. I use x strokes in combination with circle strokes to set the bevel all the way along the edge (both sides). I don't really use pressure, maybe a little bit on the 1K, after that I don't use pressure if the edge is moving nicely a long when I check the scope.

When you go to a 4k, say a Norton (I use these), You're basically sharpening and polishing the bevel. I use a BBW slurry stone on my nortons, it cuts real well with this (thanks, Ken!), but if you don't have one it's all good. After the 4K I got to the 8K side and just polish away, I use circles and x strokes on my Nortons also. After each K jump I just check the edge with a scope and I see if I am polishing and reducing the bevel scratches a long the entire edge, this is the same throughout the whole process. I stop using the norton 4k when I can shave my arm hairs without the blade tugging or pulling. I do the same thing on the 8K side and just check the arm shaving until the hairs just fall off the arm without popping, it's more of a clean cut, I check this every 10 strokes or so to not over hone. I then go to a Naniwa 12 K and do about 10 passes or so, I then strop on linen and leather, usually about 30/60 pass.

Hope that helps as a guide with the stones I have. This works for me every time and I have no issues with my edges now, it took a while to figure it out while looking out advise on the forums for about six months.

Originally Posted by LarryAndro

I have numbers of junk razors, and would give you one. Their metal is better than the Gold Dollar. Their problems range from bad scales to bad rust in spots on the blade. The Gold Dollar will do. But, if you're buying, why not go free?

PM me for my address if interested/

That's why this website rules.


Also, I don't see any mentioned of your hones being flat or lapped to make sure they're actually flat. You can't hone on new stones, they must be lapped and flattened first when you unbox them.

I keep finding things to add so I keep editing, apologies. I Also see no mention of how long you're been trying to shave with a straight? Just that a lone took me several months to get good at!

A + 1 on getting a pro honed razor to shave with and to gauge your own efforts. A 4k will set a bevel but it will take more time than a 1k or thereabouts. The way I learned was to use the TNT as an initial test for the bevel setting. I do a series of circles and back and forth strokes followed by x strokes. Once the edge digs in well and uniformly for the full length using the TNT I do say 10 more x strokes and go from the 1k to the 4k. If all you have is the 4k then once you get the TNT do the 10 x strokes, At this point the edge should shave arm or leg hair easily. Check the edge with your 30x and if there are no micro chips and the edge looks good it is on to the 4/8 pyramids.

Now I'm not using the TNT at all anymore but I am using the TPT. If you're not familiar with it a good way to learn it is to practice it with one of your Feather blades .....carefully. As I progress towards the end of the pyramid I will try popping hair on my leg or forearm without touching skin. When the razor can have the hair falling like rain I know I'm making progress. When you've completed your selected pyramid if the razor pops hair well strop and try shaving off of the 8k. If it shaves well go on to the 12k to refine the edge further. Here and here are two pyramid methods from the SRP Wiki that I have used with success.

Personally I never examine the scratches. I've bought many razors that were honed by expert pro honers that had visible scratch patterns. They shaved great. I rely on the tests mentioned above. I'm not looking at these edges with 30x eyes so if they shave well it matters little to me whether the bevels are as shiny as a new dime.YMMV. OTOH, I have also bought razors from pro honers that did have smooth and shiny bevels and some of mine end up that way but as I say, the shave is what matters to me.

As far as the irritation after getting bbs with one pass and your feather..... are you familiar with the multiple pass shaving technique ? A.K.A. gradual stubble removal technique. Until I learned that and began to practice it irritation and razor burn was a problem. Here is an article from the SRP Wiki on the topic.

Originally Posted by bluefoxicy

I shave with a razor I honed myself, but the edge is not that sharp. It won't pass the HHT (I've gotten it to pop a hair lowered onto it aggressively, but it mostly lets them slide off without biting and cutting) and the edge is extremely shiny but full of visible scratches (mind you, what's visible to me is visible to you... with at least 30x magnification; I don't use anything less than 50x because the lens interferes with my vision, and I don't own ANY lenses at the moment so it's moot).

I'm thinking instead of constantly trying to rehone my Dovo, I'll just buy a $15 Gold Dollar 208 and maul that bad boy up. Besides, it'll give me a shot at finding/fixing defects; and it's a cheap razor made of decent steel, not an expensive razor made of awesome German or Swedish steel, so I can tear it up or have fun cutting a spike point onto it. I have a couple Pakistani specials, but ... they don't seem to take an edge at all, the steel flakes, the edge feels like it's made of paper.

Think the issue might be too much pressure on the 4k? I eased up honing on the 8k, but it hasn't smoothed out the edge. It looks like I have some pretty deep scratches, possibly from setting the bevel at 4k, with maybe too much pressure. I don't know.

I'm a little confused with your approach. Let me summarize your three paragraphs may be it'll be clearer
* You can't hone your razor well enough.
* You think you are using too much pressure setting bevel on your norton 4000 side.
* You want to buy a Gold Dollar razor because using that much pressure wears your razor too much.

I rearranged the second and third paragraph summaries to fix the logical flow. I hope this will make you see the picture clearer.
Let us know what happens.