Thread: beggining to hate loathe and despise honing

Trapperjohnme,

I would not try to hone many razors. I would pick one and get the techique down for that one razor. Once it is shave ready then I would take the next razor.

Each razor has its own honing character and you will learn to adjust for it very quickly as you hone it, but as a beginner you are just throwing in too many variables (by honing many razors) that it becomes very difficult to figure out what you are doing wrong or right.

Take one and keep honing it until you get it right. It should not take much once you have the right motion. At first it may take hours. Use a microscope to view the edge every couple of laps at least. This will give you visual feedback to your honing. Otherwise you are in the dark and have to guess what is happening to the edge.

Lack of feedback makes the learning much longer, at least it does for me.

Originally Posted by vladsch

Lack of feedback makes the learning much longer, at least it does for me.

I think you hit the nail on the head.The biggest problem for me was knowing where I was and where I was going. That's total lack of feedback. I began succeeding when I learned to use the thumb test. It allowed me to pick up a razor and evaluate it, and it lt me monitor what I was doing.

Everybody needs to learn reliable testing methods, otherwise you'll be going back and forth repeatedly between shaving and honing, which can be very frustrating.

Everybody needs to learn reliable testing methods, otherwise you'll be going back and forth repeatedly between shaving and honing, which can be very frustrating

Amen!

My problem is the only test i realy have is feeling the edge (not very good at that) and the HHT

I have a RS 60-100X microscope but in my eye the edge always looks good, Edge is smooth, bevel seems consistant and coming off the 4000 it looks black.

I spent 2 hours on a razor last night and 1.5 hours on a razor tonight and still cant get either to pass the HHT without stropping.

I know people say that the real test is in the shave but a newb like me needs something better than a potential self sacrifice in the mirror to evaluate an edge.

Originally Posted by trapperjohnme

Amen!

My problem is the only test i realy have is feeling the edge (not very good at that) and the HHT

I have a RS 60-100X microscope but in my eye the edge always looks good, Edge is smooth, bevel seems consistant and coming off the 4000 it looks black.

I spent 2 hours on a razor last night and 1.5 hours on a razor tonight and still cant get either to pass the HHT without stropping.

I know people say that the real test is in the shave but a newb like me needs something better than a potential self sacrifice in the mirror to evaluate an edge.

You seem to have a few you could develop.

The microscope is a lot better than you think. If you're seeing black after the 4K you may not have enough light or you may holding the blade at a bad angle. I can always see striations at 60x. You can also see small imperfections and chips in the edge. If you can get a razor to look straight and flat at 100x it should be shavable. Maybe it won't pop hairs but it should shave OK. On the other hand if you see micro chips and unevenness it probably won't.

I have combined the thumb test and thumbnail test into a system that works for me. I'm going to post it in my gallery if you want to have a look.

Trapper, work on one razor until it is done. Use the X pattern as shown in the permanent help files here. Do not use the sweep motion. Develop your test methods, thumbnail test, thumb test and hanging hair test. Test frequently so that you develop a feel for the rate of change that occurs.

Also be sure your 'pressure' is correct. You want to use a moderate to light pressure to start tapering of to light pressure throughout most of the honing and finish with ultra light on the last few passes. Not enough pressure throughout, say trying ultra-light all the way through and the edge won't come. Too much pressure at the end and the delicate edge won't come.

Be sure you are getting the whole edge as well. To accomplish this gradually roll the main point of contact withthe hone from the heel to thye tip as you progress along the hone. Don't stay too long on any area even if this means doing 'short' trips.

Hope we're not helping to make you crazy.

X

Originally Posted by xman

Also be sure your 'pressure' is correct. You want to use a moderate to light pressure to start tapering of to light pressure throughout most of the honing and finish with ultra light on the last few passes. Not enough pressure throughout, say trying ultra-light all the way through and the edge won't come. Too much pressure at the end and the delicate edge won't come.

Actually pressure matters the most at the end. THe rest of the time it's most important to keep pressure uniform so that the bevel and flat of the spine are both of uniform width. The PhD. report that was posted a while back noted that a "burr" can form near the edge from honing. Actually, it's more of a bulge on the bevel close to the edge, which makes the edge look wider. That could only happen if your strokes caused the metal to flow backwards minutely. It seems that would be pressure related, so the pressure must be kept down as you approach the final, thin edge.

Be sure you are getting the whole edge as well. To accomplish this gradually roll the main point of contact withthe hone from the heel to thye tip as you progress along the hone. Don't stay too long on any area even if this means doing 'short' trips.

I'm not sure I understand what you're saying, but it seems like you're sweeping the blade while you're honing. If that's what you mean it should only be done if you're trying to get a curved edge. If you think about it, when you sweep the edge receives more abrasive contact as you progress to the point. Over time, you get a blade that's honed more as you go towards the tip, instead of an even hone across the edge. We've all seen these types of edges on Ebay razors.

Originally Posted by Joe Lerch

I'm not sure I understand what you're saying, but it seems like you're sweeping the blade while you're honing.

If by "sweeping" you mean beginning with the heel leading and moving the tip farther than the heel, then NO that's not what I mean. I'm referring to the "rock 'n roll" method which I find beneficial for even dead flat edges.

X