Thread: Barber hone vs J-Nat

Originally Posted by rickboone

What I have wondered since playing around with these hones, and forgive me if this should go somewhere else, but say you have an edge finished on 8k and one finished on... I don't know...some fine finisher, let's go with J-nat or pastes. Would the rougher finisher blade last longer, the one off the 8k?

My thinking is the finer finishing stone would produce a more delicate edge that while it feels better, doesn't last as long. Is there any truth and merit to my thinking?

Don't confuse Sharp and Smooth...

Sharp = the thinness of the blade edge
Smooth = equals the lack of striations on the sides of the bevel...

Razors can only get so sharp (about .38-.48 micron) they attain that level at a pretty low grit, the final Finisher should do (most of) it's work on the sides of the bevel...
There is going to be some engineering types that will discuss the final .01-.02 microns but really finishers are all about the sides of the bevels...

So to answer the question they should hold the edge about the same length of time regardless of finishers...

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Don't confuse Sharp and Smooth...

Sharp = the thinness of the blade edge
Smooth = equals the lack of striations on the sides of the bevel...

Razors can only get so sharp (about .38-.48 micron) they attain that level at a pretty low grit, the final Finisher should do (most of) it's work on the sides of the bevel...
There is going to be some engineering types that will discuss the final .01-.02 microns but really finishers are all about the sides of the bevels...

So to answer the question they should hold the edge about the same length of time regardless of finishers...

So, in essence a finisher is not removing metal, it is just smoothing it out? Like...buffing it or something? Well, we use the term polish.

Originally Posted by rickboone

So, in essence a finisher is not removing metal, it is just smoothing it out? Like...buffing it or something? Well, we use the term polish.

Sorta...

Let's say the side of the bevel looks like this at 4k, with those lines representing Striations (Scratches)

! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !

at 8 k

! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !

at 16k

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The striations become smaller and more shallow

think about sanding wood you start by getting wood level and even 60-120 grit (Bevel set)

Then you move to making the entire surface very even 150-220 grit (Sharpening)

You concentrate or getting the last imperfections out of the wood 220-400 (Polishing)

and finally you are looking for that glass smooth surface 600-2000 grit (Finishing)


Pretty much the same principle for honing only different grits...
by the time you get to the high grit there is very little material being removed..

The difference is with Honing you are doing two things at the same time, you are creating a Vee like this at the edge / \ / \ /\ so as that gets smaller then you are also smoothing the sides of the striations that you created by doing that...

Wow that made no sense LOL sorry I need to learn how to do those cool graphics...


So imagine that the Vee is pretty much as small as it is going to get at the sharpening level, and the above that you are only trying to smooth out the work that is took on the sides to get there... Again the Vee will get a very tiny bit sharper too...


Now to put this back on topic before Oz man kicks me

The Vee would essentially be pretty darn close between the BH and the J-nat but the scratches on the side would be different .....

To aswer the original question, I agree with Glen's first post.

And just to throw in a little fun, keep in mind jnat's are a very broad class of hones and even all the jnats of a given type (say, all Asagi's) vary - I don't know enough to say by how much, but I'd assume a fair bit. The same is true of barber hones - there are loads of different ones and they all act differently. Maybe, somewhere out there, there is a barber hone that gives a finish that is very close to the Asagi in question. Maybe it's so close not even RayG could tell the difference... one never can be too sure.

Personally, I can hardly tell various finishers apart, and I doubt the average guy can reliably tell the difference either.

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Now to put this back on topic before Oz man kicks me

The Vee would essentially be pretty darn close between the BH and the J-nat but the scratches on the side would be different .....

EEEEE Yahh ! Sorry couldn't find an adequate kicking emoticon
G man, you're assuming all striations are shaped the same. Wait a minute. Can I hijack my own thread ?

Seriously tho, when it comes down to how it feels on the face "All roads lead to Rome"

Originally Posted by onimaru55

EEEEE YAHH ! G man, you're assuming all striations are shaped the same. Wait a minute. Can I hijack my own thread ?

Seriously tho, when it comes down to how it feels on the face "All roads lead to Rome"

Not Assuming LOL

I was "Avoiding", that part of the discussion hehehe

LOL ... You're up late

Woke up early my friend from down under..

Me thinks that this Coyote pack that is roaming has very little time left on the planet..

Pesky Varmints !
What's the weapon of choice ?

Well being as the Wifey has given the green light to this project, we are probably going to bait them into the back pasture with some old deer meat from the freezer (she actually is thawing it out) and use the "Coyote Killing Machine" which is a semi custom Mossberg 1500 in 22-250 I built some years back... which has been honed to a unique smoothness (staying on topic) LMAO

Funny thing about the wife, she hates when I hunt, she loves the animals, right up until they could threaten her precious little dogs, then I get the "Kill them, kill them all" orders.. She saw those lights go on in the back, and heard those Coyotes speaking in the back yard the other night, I knew it was over

Now if they get close enough again to turn on the security lights on the house then the Mini-14 is sitting at the back deck now...