Thread: Final observations on hard paddle with chrome oxide

I like my hard paddle with chrome oxide. Finishing on this gives me a far less irritating shave than I get when I shave right off the Swaty. Since it's hard oak, there's no convexing of the edge, which I also like.

However, I am quickly coming to the conclusion that I don't like using it for touch-ups. Between the paddle and my nylon-webbing "linen" strop. I can keep a razor going for a pretty long time, but the more I use the paddle, the more I seem to get a very weird effect: the edge still shaves, but it just doesn't feel right. It feels like it takes more pressure than it should, and this gets worse and worse.

So I've been using the Swaty, and finishing on the paddle, every time I need to touch up.

I worked with a guy named Stan who's an engineer and a general fiddler with things, and knows quite a lot about sharpening. He proposed the following theory:

In the image below, (a) represents the edge right after you've honed; a sharp, triangular cross section. (b) represents the edge that needs touching up: teeth have broken off. (c) represents what you get by backhoning (b) on the paddle. The backhoning motion draws steel from the edges out into two sharp points on either side of the still-broken center. It will cut hair since it has sharp points, but will require more pressure to do so.

This theory could be complete malarkey. I don't have an electron microscope with which to verify it. But I thought it was interesting enough to put out there.

Anyway, I'm satisfied that the paddle is an excellent way to sleaze your way out of not having anything finer than a Swaty to finish on. It's cheap & easy to make, which is probably why our ancestors used them. But don't sell off all your barber hones; if you have a heavy beard or soft razor or both, you can't really use the paddle for long-term maintenance.

Since I'm married to an engineer, I'm loathe to disagree, but I think this is malarkey. I don't believe CroOx can draw out a double edge to an extent to produce a new cutting edge. I also don't think the dulling occurs as indicated in figure (b) but I don't have time to elaborate at the moment.

For now, I'll just say "stick with the Swaty."

The paste is actually abrasive, so it does remove metal and will put an edge back on the razor, assuming the edge hasnt deteriorated so far as to need to use a lower grit than CrOx.

Paste will only bring the razor back so far though, so you'll end up with a slightly rounded version of diagram A after paste I reckon. So the paste will remove the square edges off the edge in diagram B, and restore some of the cutting ability but not all of it. Thats why you need to apply more pressure when shaving IMO, and why eventually you need to drop back to a hone to fully restore the edge.

The slight sag you get with a pasted hanging strop will also round the edge off slightly as well, so the edge, in cross section, looks more like a rifle bullet than a triangle.

Razor steel is so darn hard that I'm not sure its malleable enough to form those fins you have in diagram C. I might be wrong of course, but those are my thoughts.

I hope my ramblings make a bit of sense without pictures!

i think thats the problem with touch ups on paste ,the edge will only give you a thew good shaves .then its back to the paste.some guys keep there razor going with paste for months. i'd much rather use hone and paste just the once and then back to hone.

I guess my main objection to the speculation is the idea of the steel being drawn out to form new edges. I don't see how the chrome ox could be pulling the steel out as depicted. This is a different concept from removing steel.

Yeah, that's the part that I wasn't getting my head around either Ron. IME abrasion/honing removes material, but doesn't stretch, draw out, extrude metal.

I flipped the switch and the light went on. I haven't figured out why it did. I'm too busy with other stuff. If my first pass is harsh or needs improvement I have found that 5 weight of the blade round trips on a flat bed with felt impregnated chrom-ox will smooth it out and add keenness. I haven't figured out why yet .... got to get an electron microscope I guess. BTW, Randy and I were talking about what grit barber hones really are. He pointed out that the amount of abrasive in a barber hone is far more per square inch than that found in a waterstone. Hence the barber hone is fast for touch ups but may not be ideal for honing a razor on a regular basis.

You aren't going to "draw" out the material on hardened steel without major heat. I'm talking about red-hot heat & I know that I can't strop that fast. I keep on going back to your OP and can't help to question the statement of "it takes more pressure than it should" It shouldn't take pressure to shave period. From what I am getting in the OP, it appears as though the razor needs the bevel needs re-set.

From my experience so far, CROX will extend the use of a razor for a longer period, diamond even longer...but I don't "think" any pastes will do away with re-setting a bevel once and a while. I'm seeing how long I can go with .5 micron diamond now & haven't had to re-set a bevel in a while...but the jury is still out. I exclusively use paddle strops that are just shy of 2' to ensure that I don't roll an edge. My thoughts are that my stones are flat, strop should be too...