Thread: New member - challenged honing

Guys I am a new member. I have been making my way from a Gillette Sensor. I started using safety razors about two years ago. I tried a Gillette superspeed and liked it. I then went to the Gillette fat boy. Made my way to a Gem single edged -Micromatic. I called that the butcher could never shave regularly without cuts. Next tried a Gem JR. I have been using that with a lot of success for over a year.

I always liked the idea of a straight razor but never made the jump. Recently I decided to give it a try. I order an old razor from Ebay. I got a B J Eyre for about $10. I ordered a Norton 1000/8000 combo stone. The razor did not look too bad on arrival. I cleaned it with steel wool, disinfected it, and then polished it. I used a buffing wheel on my drill press and some white compound - looked pretty decent.

I moved on to honing on the Norton stone. Took a bit of work. I started with the 1000 side and worked through some of the surface corrosion. I kept honing until the edge looked pretty smooth. I used a microscope at 100 power to check on my progress. I then moved to the 8000 side. I kept honing until I no longer see progress. Blade feels sharp on nail and thumb. I cannot seem to make any more progress but cannot get close to passing the hanging hair test. Any ideas as to what I could be doing wrong?

I will try to post images of the edge.

Thanks for any help.

Ed

These images are at 150X

This is after the 1000 grit side.


This is after the 8000 grit side.

A couple of things. First, I'm not certain that Norton makes a 1k/8k combo. It might, since I'm not all that familiar with the Norton combo hones. I have 7 Nortons but all are single grit hones. Second, if your hone actually is 1k/8k, then that is the problem right there. You cannot jump from 1k to 8k, as the 8k cannot possibly polish out the peaks left by a 1k hone. You are going to have to invest in a Norton 4k hone.

I am a bit tired, so I will try to be short and concise here. Hopefully i do not miss anything.

1) You really need something between the 1k & 8k

2) The Thumbnail test is only good for the initial bevel setting stage. you can ruin the edge you spent all that time working on at the 8k level.

3) I would not worry about the HHT quite yet. It is a test you really need to calibrate with razors that are a known quality. Aka honed by someone else so you know they are shave ready and can interpret the results

4) You are really biting off a lot trying to learn to hone,strop and shave all at once. I think you would be better off sending that razor out to be honed, maybe buying a second razor shave ready if you find a good deal. Then you can concentrate on the basics and stropping. You will not have that worry in the back of your mind that the razor is not as sharp as it should be.

Just knowing what a shave ready razor should feel like is a bigger task than you would think. Bad stropping will take a shave ready razor and make it shave like crap too.

Thanks for those quick responses.

I'm going to try to make a run out to Woodcraft today for a King 4000 grit waterstone - I don't want to have to mail order and wait.

I should hopefully also be receiving an Illinois 835 strop today as well.

If I'm lucky I should be honing again tonight. I went back to the Gem JR today to give my chin some time to recover from yesterday's handiwork. I am really finding dealing with my chin a challenge. My improperly sharpened razor cannot be helping that either. Learning to shave with my left hand as well as my right is also something of an adventure.

Called Woodcraft and they don't have it. I mail ordered it. I guess that will give my chin a week to heal before I get back to it again. Darn that's too bad.

Ed

if this picture is 100x final finish edge then you are doing something wrong.
you will need to have as mentioned early something between 1-8k and when you do work on 8k remember don't use pressure .
(small chips on the edge is sign of 1, pressure,2 is too many passes on nroton 8k)
The best way will be have a razor honed by pro's then take a look to the edge on 100x(which you have)
.After seen properly honed edge you can try to get similar edge.
that will help you more then anything else.

Originally Posted by hi_bud_gl

if this picture is 100x final finish edge then you are doing something wrong.
you will need to have as mentioned early something between 1-8k and when you do work on 8k remember don't use pressure .
(small chips on the edge is sign of 1, pressure,2 is too many passes on nroton 8k)
The best way will be have a razor honed by pro's then take a look to the edge on 100x(which you have)
.After seen properly honed edge you can try to get similar edge.
that will help you more then anything else.

You might be right, but the appearance of the 8k edge could just as likely be the result of the 1k, with the 8k simply failing to remove the remnants of the 1k.

eddy when you say it looked good after 1k did it look like that?

I bet you have a good bit more corrosion to get through.

while waiting for 4k spend some time correcting those chips

Originally Posted by Utopian

You might be right, but the appearance of the 8k edge could just as likely be the result of the 1k, with the 8k simply failing to remove the remnants of the 1k.

Ron i agree with you .
In your case 8k stone hasn't done it is job yet .
he should stay in 8 k longer he has been.
In any way the picture which says after 8k is not looks like 8k edge.
There is no way we could say 100% what is the reason until he gives us more information what he has done how many strokes on each stone, how much pressure etc.
difficult way to go.
i think the best will be he gets 4 k and properly honed blade.
watches the edge how should be and hones his own blade.
i hope he is not changed temper on the blade while he was cleaning with Dremel
.

Originally Posted by Slartibartfast

4) You are really biting off a lot trying to learn to hone,strop and shave all at once. I think you would be better off sending that razor out to be honed, maybe buying a second razor shave ready if you find a good deal. Then you can concentrate on the basics and stropping. You will not have that worry in the back of your mind that the razor is not as sharp as it should be.

Just knowing what a shave ready razor should feel like is a bigger task than you would think. Bad stropping will take a shave ready razor and make it shave like crap too.

I notice that you are not addressing some fantastic advice you are receiving from Slartibartfast I quoted above. I don't know if you have special skills already that can get you honing right out the shoot, but I agree wholeheartedly with Slartibartfast. There are many aspects of this art that are very difficult to master in order to bring them all together and get a great shave, so why not start with a shave ready razor and take that mystery out of the equation? Honing is really the last thing that most of us learn. Not that you can't learn it now, but you at least need a properly honed razor to compare your work to.

Man you are taking a VERY big bite at once. I have been shaving with straights since March of this year and have yet to even purchase a hone of any kind. Some people may think that this is slow but i feel that i need to concentrate on my shaving and stropping technique and get them reasonably passable before i throw, what i feel, the hardest thing about straight razor shaving in the mix. I am lucky to have some one in the same town that belongs to this society and is somewhat willing to hone my razors for me. I suggest, as others have in this post, that you send the razor to a person in the classifieds that can hone it for you and take out all the guess work while you are still learning to shave, lather, stretch, strop and learn all the different directions that your whiskers grow in. That is just my humble opinion.