Thread: Coticules for Dummies

This is a thread split from the JNat for Dummies thread.

It is possible to get a razor shave ready off a lower grit. I routinely pop hairs off my Chosera 1K and 2K. If you're bevel is set correctly, and it's not an easy chore sometimes, then you should have good results with a coticule. When I'm working my coticule, I try to keep the slurry pretty then. I have found that a heavy slurry can degrade a good bevel. You have to find that sweet spot where the slurry is a benefit to sharpening, not an interference and dulling your blade.

I've heard by more experienced members here that it is possible. I use a Norton 1/4k before my coticule, and while I can get the razor to cut arm hair with ease, I can do 300 laps on the coticule using the dilucot method, then an additional 50 on water, and still have a pulling sensation after stropping. Perhaps I should try shaving right off the stone? I suppose I'm frustrated because I've been a daily straight razor shaver for a year, not used a disposable since last February, and I'm still having trouble getting a perfectly smooth shave without pastes, right off the stone. I think I brought this subject up in another thread...

Originally Posted by woodsmandave

I've heard by more experienced members here that it is possible. I use a Norton 1/4k before my coticule, and while I can get the razor to cut arm hair with ease, I can do 300 laps on the coticule using the dilucot method, then an additional 50 on water, and still have a pulling sensation after stropping. Perhaps I should try shaving right off the stone? I suppose I'm frustrated because I've been a daily straight razor shaver for a year, not used a disposable since last February, and I'm still having trouble getting a perfectly smooth shave without pastes, right off the stone. I think I brought this subject up in another thread...

have you tried to go to Coticule after 8k?
if you are getting the same pulling sensation after higher than 4k grit, then you have very coarse coticule or you need to work on technique to get best edge possible from your particular coticule.

I go to the coticule after the 4k, and use slurry on the coticule, then gradually dilute it until its clear water only. I've done this 100's of times with dozens of razors over the past year. By the finishing stages of the coticule on water, water washes over the top of the blade from heel to toe on both sides, with no pressure on the stone. I take that as an indication that the razor is done on the hones, and I strop 75 each side on leather, light. When I go to shave, I still usually get some "pulling," until i do 5-10 laps on my linen with diamond spray.

I've listened to everybody's advice on this website, and tried it many times. I just can't seem to get a good shave off my coticule without pastes I have a fine slate finisher, and 20-30 laps each side after the coticule will give me an effortless shave 50% of the time, but it's hit or miss. I can never seem to get rid of the pastes...

Does it sound like my problem lies in an improperly set bevel? I don't believe it is possible that it is that, but again, I'm no expert, as much as I like to think I know what I'm doing.

Originally Posted by woodsmandave

I go to the coticule after the 4k, and use slurry on the coticule, then gradually dilute it until its clear water only. I've done this 100's of times with dozens of razors over the past year. By the finishing stages of the coticule on water, water washes over the top of the blade from heel to toe on both sides, with no pressure on the stone. I take that as an indication that the razor is done on the hones, and I strop 75 each side on leather, light. When I go to shave, I still usually get some "pulling," until i do 5-10 laps on my linen with diamond spray.

I've listened to everybody's advice on this website, and tried it many times. I just can't seem to get a good shave off my coticule without pastes I have a fine slate finisher, and 20-30 laps each side after the coticule will give me an effortless shave 50% of the time, but it's hit or miss. I can never seem to get rid of the pastes...

Does it sound like my problem lies in an improperly set bevel? I don't believe it is possible that it is that, but again, I'm no expert, as much as I like to think I know what I'm doing.

Some think that there are coticules that are not capable of imparting the sharpness required for straight razors. I have yet to meet a coticule that fit that description, but there is one way you could find out for sure. Try the unicot method. You can find plenty of information on it, but in short you just add one layer of tape at the end of your honing regimen and do some very weightless water-only strokes (rinse the stone often to remove the chance of autoslurrying affecting your edge). Since the coticule will be contacting only the very edge of the bevel, you'll get a very clear picture of what in fact your coticule is capable of doing.

Originally Posted by woodsmandave

I go to the coticule after the 4k, and use slurry on the coticule, then gradually dilute it until its clear water only. I've done this 100's of times with dozens of razors over the past year. By the finishing stages of the coticule on water, water washes over the top of the blade from heel to toe on both sides, with no pressure on the stone. I take that as an indication that the razor is done on the hones, and I strop 75 each side on leather, light. When I go to shave, I still usually get some "pulling," until i do 5-10 laps on my linen with diamond spray.

I've listened to everybody's advice on this website, and tried it many times. I just can't seem to get a good shave off my coticule without pastes I have a fine slate finisher, and 20-30 laps each side after the coticule will give me an effortless shave 50% of the time, but it's hit or miss. I can never seem to get rid of the pastes...

Does it sound like my problem lies in an improperly set bevel? I don't believe it is possible that it is that, but again, I'm no expert, as much as I like to think I know what I'm doing.

ok two questions can you pop arm hair above skin level on your 1k when your finished on that 1k ? what angle are you using when you shave should be around a 20 degree (1/4 in.)

Dave, I am a complete noob who has only honed with a coticule once, but I got a smooth, comfortable shave following pretty much the procedure you described, except I went to the coti straight from the 1k (it was a full restore which needed a new bevel after removal of a frown). I raised a milky slurry and followed the dilucot videos from Bart and Gary. After I got through the dilution of slurry to basically water, I rinsed the stone and razor, did 10 more laps, then rinsed again and did 10 laps with a damp stone (not full water, just a damp stone and the weight of the razor). I could probably have done a few more as I think there's still some smoothness left to be found in this blade, but that worked for me. Anyway, I know it was probably just beginner's luck, but I thought I'd share.

I am also appreciative of the wisdom in this thread related to JNats, as I am poking around reading as much as I can on them in anticipation of adding one to my collection.

Have you tried to shave after the 4k? Is it about the same as after the coticule? I'm thinking it's your coticule and not the bevel.

Does your slurry get dark on the coticule? Is the blade tending to stick when you get towards all water? You may have to play with slurry amounts.

How many razors are you shaving with? If more than one, do they all pull?

Originally Posted by Jimbo7

Some think that there are coticules that are not capable of imparting the sharpness required for straight razors. I have yet to meet a coticule that fit that description, but there is one way you could find out for sure. Try the unicot method. You can find plenty of information on it, but in short you just add one layer of tape at the end of your honing regimen and do some very weightless water-only strokes (rinse the stone often to remove the chance of autoslurrying affecting your edge). Since the coticule will be contacting only the very edge of the bevel, you'll get a very clear picture of what in fact your coticule is capable of doing.

When I brought up my troubles the first time, I went to coticule.be and followed the unitcot method to the "T". I still needed to use a pasted strop to get a shave that didn't pull at all.