Thread: The X-stroke: uneven edge wear by design?

Hi guys,

I've been using a straight razor for a year now, and it's been awesome to say the least! I've learned so much throughout the year, a big part of that due to all the razor-sharp minds (pun intended) on this forum.

Anyway, on to my question. I've been dabbling in honing throughout the past year, and have been able to successfully sharpen my razors. But I've always had a question about the X-stroke that just doesn't make sense to me. I've watched a ton of videos, read all the Wikis and many threads here, and to me, it seems that the recommended X-stroke leads to uneven edge wear.

When you start the X-stroke, the entire blade is on the hone. But when you're finished moving it across, only the toe half of the blade is on the hone. This means, of course, that the toe half of the blade is on the hone 100% of the time, while the heel half is not...through time, doesn't this mean that the toe half will get more honing and thus result in uneven wear on the blade?

now don't go buy me 100 percent because I just started honing myself but I've been honing successfully using the x strokes and you're not supposed to start off on the stone flat you're supposed to start off slightly on the heel edge or toe edge bring it down to the opposite direction then move it over and work back up in the opposite direction- thus the X pattern. depending on the size of your hone it may be very very slight x strokes, but x strokes nevertheless. this has worked perfectly for me!. I never start on the stone directly in the middle, always off to 1 side or the other. hopefully some more experience honers will jump in here and correct me if I'm wrong.

IME even though the point end is on the hone throughout the stroke, while the heel leaves the hone fairly early, we unconciously put more pressure on the heel than on the point. This is evident in trying HHT and finding the last 1/2" of the blade, at the point end, frequently needs more attention to equal the sharpness of the rest of the blade. IME anyway. Lifting the shoulder and elbow as you are doing your stroke can help in that area. IIRC I learned about the shoulder from Lynn and the elbow thanks to Disburden.

The thing with the X stroke is that even if your stone is no longer absolutely flat, through hone wear, the edge will generally hit all the way through the stroke. If you had a wide enough stone to just run your back and forth passes in a straight line the low spots in the hone wouldn't make contact with the edge unless the stone was perfectly flat. The X stroke compensates for that. From what I see honemeisters are going to circles now anyhow which is another thread I guess.

Jimmy-
in your professional experience just out of curiosity was I right that I hit that on the mark generally speaking? I want to learn just as well!
Tony

Originally Posted by anthogia

Jimmy-
in your professional experience just out of curiosity was I right that I hit that on the mark generally speaking? I want to learn just as well!
Tony

Hey Tony, since I don't hone razors for money generally, though I've made exceptions, mine is not a "professional" opinion. OTOH, I've honed a lot of razors so that is worth something I guess. Yeah, I don't start in the middle either but if I understand your post correctly you are doing it correctly.

Also to the OP, if you notice what appears to be unevenness in the size of the bevel or the wear on the spine, that isn't necessarily because of incorrect honing. Many razors are not exactly parallel from one end to the other or in the relationship of spine to bevel. If that is the case the point or heel may show a slightly wider or narrower bevel than the center area ..... or visa versa. Saying that it may be that way with correct honing ..... OTOH, incorrect honing, like too much pressure, or inconsistent pressure. stroke, can also cause uneven wear.

Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

Hey Tony, since I don't hone razors for money generally, though I've made exceptions, mine is not a "professional" opinion. OTOH, I've honed a lot of razors so that is worth something I guess. Yeah, I don't start in the middle either but if I understand your post correctly you are doing it correctly.

Also to the OP, if you notice what appears to be unevenness in the size of the bevel or the wear on the spine, that isn't necessarily because of incorrect honing. Many razors are not exactly parallel from one end to the other or in the relationship of spine to bevel. If that is the case the point or heel may show a slightly wider or narrower bevel than the center area ..... or visa versa.

Thanks Jimmy! I've been working at it hard so I don't want all my hard work to go to waste if I've been doing it wrong -lol!

Tony, what do you mean when you are saying not to lay the razor flat and to start on toe edge or heel edge? To me you're describing a pronounced rolling x stroke. The only time I really lift the edge off the hone is when the smile is very pronounced or there is warping of the spine. Typically the rolling x-stroke is just rolling the 'pressure' from the heel of the spine to the toe of the spine. I wouldn't recommend lifting the spine of the blade off the hone unless there is an issue with the razor.

Originally Posted by brooksie967

Tony, what do you mean when you are saying not to lay the razor flat and to start on toe edge or heel edge? To me you're describing a pronounced rolling x stroke. The only time I really lift the edge off the hone is when the smile is very pronounced or there is warping of the spine. Typically the rolling x-stroke is just rolling the 'pressure' from the heel of the spine to the toe of the spine. I wouldn't recommend lifting the spine of the blade off the hone unless there is an issue with the razor.

basically I start with either the heel or the toe to the left or the right of the stone but not on the stone and then bring it down diagonally across the stone. then I take the opposite side put that off the stone and move diagonally in the opposite direction and thus the x pattern. basically I do very small x strokes because my nanis are very wide.

My only concern with the process you are describing is whether or not you're honing your razors on the stabilizer that may or may not exist on it. I haven't read too much into that but I don't typically lay any part of the stabilizer on the hone unless it is worn to that point already as to avoid creating a heel hook.

Originally Posted by brooksie967

My only concern with the process you are describing is whether or not you're honing your razors on the stabilizer that may or may not exist on it. I haven't read too much into that but I don't typically lay any part of the stabilizer on the hone unless it is worn to that point already as to avoid creating a heel hook.

that was a big problem for me but I learned to avoid the stabilizer and now I don't have a problem.