Thread: Touching up and finishing

Yeah, a lot of it is just down to practice to develop feel, and once that happens you'll have a much better idea when to move up to the next hone.

That having been said, if the pyramid is what works for you, then run with it! Like pfries, I used to use the pyramid but gradually realized that I was getting a good enough idea of what was going on with the edge as I went along and at that point I too stopped using that particular system. But if it's working don't stop!

Pushing vs cutting under the water is a useful indicator that you've done about as much as can be done with that particular hone. Once the water starts riding up the blade instead of running ahead of it, consider moving on.

It's also worth remembering this ain't rocket science. Take your time, be gentle, be aware of what's happening between the blade and the hone, and in time it will start coming together.

Yes I meant swarf. Touchup could be a pasted strop which is the easiest. But if your gonna break out the hones, then break em out! I dont know if you have a pasted strop. If you do, then that will be the touchup you may need only. If not then the 8k then 12k would be what I would do. The amount of laps x strokes etc would remove very little metal. And with an average human lifespan of 80 years you dont have to worry about killing the razor.

Originally Posted by bill3152

Yes I meant swarf. Touchup could be a pasted strop which is the easiest. But if your gonna break out the hones, then break em out! I dont know if you have a pasted strop. If you do, then that will be the touchup you may need only. If not then the 8k then 12k would be what I would do. The amount of laps x strokes etc would remove very little metal. And with an average human lifespan of 80 years you dont have to worry about killing the razor.

This is one of the things I love about this stuff - there are many paths to the mountaintop, and plenty of scope for messing around and finding out what works for you.

I have never used a pasted strop and so that's not something that leaps to mind for me. But after a recent conversation over coffee with Badgister, I have some CrOx on order and will be playing around with it soon. So stay tuned... my answer may change the next time this question comes around.

Some little refreshes are nothing more than a few passes on crox or diamond spray before stroping and your good to go. Other times you have to hit some form of stone. There are many ways to do this but I think pyramid approaches work well even at this type of stage. When honing I used to do the 4/8 pyramid then do 8-10 polishing strokes on the 16K (in your case 12K- they are basically the same- maybe not on the microscope but in terms of how they feel on your face). Now I proceed from a 4/8 pyramid and then do a 8/16 pyramid. This principle works for times when you have to do a refresh but not really a honing- so to speak. So you might try a 5/5,3/3,1/3,1/5 pyramid with 8/12 before you hit the diamond spray, Zulu, CF, Escher, Jnat or whatever. The key thing, as we all know, is to make sure the mediums used are FLAT and that your strokes are light and true and find a pattern that works for you that is consistent.

So, if its a touch up. I first try the last thing I do before leather stroping- like crox on felt. If that doesn't cut it (pun intended) I then go to an 8/16 pyramid then final finisher then leather strop. I only do either of these things when I'm confident that my bevel is good across the entire edge. If I begin to doubt that I sometimes put a marker on the edge, take a couple of laps on a finishing stone and examine it under magnification to see that the entire edge was hit.

There are two things that can cause a frustrating evening; 1) Doing a refresh on something only to discover that it really needs a more concerted refresh or even a proper honing (or) 2) Doing a proper honing only to discover that the bevel needs to be reset. But, I would rather risk those things than unnecessarily removing too much metal. And, of course, I've done all those things before. I'm learning like all of us that you get a feel for these things and you become more efficient as you go and the dreaded overhoning can indeed be a thing of the past.

Originally Posted by Cangooner

Yeah, a lot of it is just down to practice to develop feel, and once that happens you'll have a much better idea when to move up to the next hone.

Recently I've made some progress in my honing. All along I kept asking others and of myself, what should I be looking for? What are the signs that things are going well or that I'm ready to move from one hone to the next? Most everyone will tell you to get a jewelers loup to check your edge during the process. But this little microscope really helped to really understand what was happening at each stage. I had a x100 scope but the x200 really give you an up close view of what is going on. Its a whopping $4 so give one a shot.

Amazon.com: Handheld Hand Held LED Lighted 160X-200X Magnification Zoom Lens Pocket Microscope Magnifier Magnifying Loupe: Office Products

I have a nice jeweler's loupe, a microscope, lighted magnifying glass- I know it's ridiculous. But I can tell more about what is going on with an edge but its feel on a hone and especially during a shave than I can by looking at the edge. I'm just not very good at judging what an edge is doing by seeing it under magnification. Usually when pictures of this are posted on this forum I can't tell much of a difference to the comparative photographs but many others can. So, some of us rely more on feel when others rely more on sight I guess.

Originally Posted by 1holegrouper

I have a nice jeweler's loupe, a microscope, lighted magnifying glass- I know it's ridiculous. But I can tell more about what is going on with an edge but its feel on a hone and especially during a shave than I can by looking at the edge. I'm just not very good at judging what an edge is doing by seeing it under magnification. Usually when pictures of this are posted on this forum I can't tell much of a difference to the comparative photographs but many others can. So, some of us rely more on feel when others rely more on sight I guess.

I was the same way and probably still would be looking at someone else's pics. But go ahead and set a bevel with a razor, then look closely at the scratch patterns under 200x magnification. Make a mental note of what they look like. Take it your next hone and do circles/laps until the scratch patterns have been completely replaced by the new grit. Make another mental note of how it looks. Then take it to the next stone (8k?) and do the same until the scratches are almost completely gone. Watching what is happening between each grit really helped me see the progress. But at 100x, the difference between 1k and 4k was negligible. But at 200x, I can see the difference in the patterns as the stone is doing its job. Also, at 200x I can see how rough the cutting edge is after 1k and 4k. I can literally see little spikes and protrusions. Then after 8k, its looking good. Also, if you have a razor the was honed by a pro, look closely at it under 200x. Then look at the one that may be giving you trouble. You'll probably see some things that separate them quite readily. I suppose this will be a case of YMMV but it really helped me understand what I was looking for between grits/stones. For once I could actually see things falling into place. I find the visual inspection more telling than say the thumb pad test - which I've never been able to determine anything from.

Originally Posted by OCDshaver

I was the same way and probably still would be looking at someone else's pics. But go ahead and set a bevel with a razor, then look closely at the scratch patterns under 200x magnification. Make a mental note of what they look like. Take it your next hone and do circles/laps until the scratch patterns have been completely replaced by the new grit. Make another mental note of how it looks. Then take it to the next stone (8k?) and do the same until the scratches are almost completely gone. Watching what is happening between each grit really helped me see the progress. But at 100x, the difference between 1k and 4k was negligible. But at 200x, I can see the difference in the patterns as the stone is doing its job. Also, at 200x I can see how rough the cutting edge is after 1k and 4k. I can literally see little spikes and protrusions. Then after 8k, its looking good. Also, if you have a razor the was honed by a pro, look closely at it under 200x. Then look at the one that may be giving you trouble. You'll probably see some things that separate them quite readily. I suppose this will be a case of YMMV but it really helped me understand what I was looking for between grits/stones. For once I could actually see things falling into place. I find the visual inspection more telling than say the thumb pad test - which I've never been able to determine anything from.

I'll try the 200X. I usually never went past 90X

For the money involved, you can't go wrong.

I have a loupe I was using ... Looking for chips etc and it's working out ok.. But for 4.00 ill try that..