Thread: PRC Hydra

Originally Posted by sharptonn

Right. That is why it works with a spacer. No movement of the scales. It works!

And that is why such a fat, flat, spacer is needed & why the scales do not flex & why a razor will sit too deeply in the scales.

I suppose an explanation is in order, Orville. We are talking mechanics here. Things which were learned over a few hundred years. A razor with a tang tapered toward the tail with corresponding wedge at the end will have the characteristics of a fluid mechanical change as-opened and to the shaving position. The scales are bowed out as at rest. As the razor is opened, it is quite easy. The small of the tapered tang at the bottom makes it easy to move. As the blade is moved to full open, the forces act against themselves as the taper on the tang acts against the wedge and the scales tend to bend inward, causing more tension on the pivot.
This is where you want a tight razor. In the shaving position(s). It alleviates excessive pressure where you don't need it and applies it where you do. Not an accident. Intentional as to many years of applying it. It works better, longer, IMO
As-said. Tight, straight square, and spacer works as well. No forces to take up for wear, though!

Apparently I missed the part where blade positioning in the scales mattered. Could someone explain? Don't say cell rot and rust because in a barbers shop the only time a razor would be closed is probably overnight, and these guys knew how to treat their tools. As for cell rot...not many barbers would have had a career long enough to worry about it (this is a modern concern due to age). That lands me back to aesthetics and tradition rather than maintenance of the tool or even safety.

I am just curious why the actual function of blade position while closed in scales is a point of contention.

As for spacer vs. wedge I can see that one going either way....I think we over think what went into these designs a little bit. Razors were a tool much like a hammer. Just enough attention went into most of them just to allow them to perform their function reliably according to the accepted standards of the time. The small portion of extremely high end razors, of course, were probably paid more attention to. On that point I am making some logic based assumptions, though I could certainly be very wrong.

Well half of my answer appeared as I was typing lol

Originally Posted by Denvernoob

Apparently I missed the part where blade positioning in the scales mattered. Could someone explain? Don't say cell rot and rust because in a barbers shop the only time a razor would be closed is probably overnight, and these guys knew how to treat their tools. As for cell rot...not many barbers would have had a career long enough to worry about it (this is a modern concern due to age). That lands me back to aesthetics and tradition rather than maintenance of the tool or even safety.

I am just curious why the actual function of blade position while closed in scales is a point of contention.

As for spacer vs. wedge I can see that one going either way....I think we over think what went into these designs a little bit. Razors were a tool much like a hammer. Just enough attention went into most of them just to allow them to perform their function reliably according to the accepted standards of the time. The small portion of extremely high end razors, of course, were probably paid more attention to. On that point I am making some logic based assumptions, though I could certainly be very wrong.

Well half of my answer appeared as I was typing lol

Sorry! Also, the width of the inside of the wedge is considered as to where the blade will sit in the scales.
Not an easy task to get it just right. JMO

OK...that was my lesson of the day, for which I thank you Tom!i I probably never would have noticed that, and if I had, I would have thought it was just aesthetics...but no, it is aesthetics with a purpose! Fascinating!

Originally Posted by sharptonn

I suppose an explanation is in order, Orville. We are talking mechanics here. Things which were learned over a few hundred years. A razor with a tang tapered toward the tail with corresponding wedge at the end will have the characteristics of a fluid mechanical change as-opened and to the shaving position. The scales are bowed out as at rest. As the razor is opened, it is quite easy. The small of the tapered tang at the bottom makes it easy to move. As the blade is moved to full open, the forces act against themselves as the taper on the tang acts against the wedge and the scales tend to bend inward, causing more tension on the pivot.
This is where you want a tight razor. In the shaving position(s). It alleviates excessive pressure where you don't need it and applies it where you do. Not an accident. Intentional as to many years of applying it. It works better, longer, IMO
As-said. Tight, straight square, and spacer works as well. No forces to take up for wear, though!

Originally Posted by sharptonn

Sorry! Also, the width of the inside of the wedge is considered as to where the blade will sit in the scales.
Not an easy task to get it just right. JMO

Awesome explanations. I appreciate the insight. Makes a lot of sense to me having read you last posts.

Originally Posted by Haroldg48

OK...that was my lesson of the day, for which I thank you Tom!i I probably never would have noticed that, and if I had, I would have thought it was just aesthetics...but no, it is aesthetics with a purpose! Fascinating!

and I've never quoted myself before, but I had to go look at the ivory W & B compared to a modern 7/8 chopper I won't name, and that design dynamic is much more clearly in play in the W & B than in the new one! Wow!!

It's discussions like this that are making me really like this place. You guys are hardcore.

Originally Posted by Denvernoob

Apparently I missed the part where blade positioning in the scales mattered. Could someone explain? Don't say cell rot and rust because in a barbers shop the only time a razor would be closed is probably overnight, and these guys knew how to treat their tools. As for cell rot...not many barbers would have had a career long enough to worry about it (this is a modern concern due to age). That lands me back to aesthetics and tradition rather than maintenance of the tool or even safety.

I mention this in post #34

"A problem with a razor that sits too deeply in the scales is that it necessitates levering the tail to open it rather than using two hands. This can lead to "stropping" the blade against the scales if you flex them."

Originally Posted by onimaru55

I mention this in post #34

"A problem with a razor that sits too deeply in the scales is that it necessitates levering the tail to open it rather than using two hands. This can lead to "stropping" the blade against the scales if you flex them."

."
I always open all of my razors with two hands, pinching the spine with one of them, regardless of where the blade sits in the scales. I have never noticed any difficulty with my purposely extra deep sitting razors. It may be because the smallest razor that I have made is 7/8 and the spine is thick enough to be easy to grab.

Deep sitting razors are more aesthetic to me. Several people have complimented me on this deep sitting style on other razor sites.