Thread: Ice Tempered Frozen Steel?

Does anyone have any experience or take on this kind of steel? I just purchased it.

Livin in Portland

That process benefits stainless steels only. I do have a favourite one, though it's vintage and unfortunately they don't seem to have made them in a 6/8 version.

I dont like that stuff

Stainless blades definately have their place & some guys really like them, I have a couple of stainless gold dollar's that go with me on my vacations to the beach...humid & salty air doesn't bother them quite as bad as carbon steel.

Slice, greetings.

There seems to be more controversy about this material and process than seems justified. The experienced guys tend to say its fine material and no - its not particularly more difficult to hone. That has been my experience also.

'Don't know what blade you got into - I overpaid for a Dovo stainless micarta. I'm underwhelmed with the value - most of which was my own ignorance as to what it should cost. I will say it gives very good shaves and would not hesitate to recommend them at a more reasonable cost.

So - what did you get?

If you're on the left coast Portland and want to talk or compare notes or work on honing, pm me.

I own the Dovo En Vogue 105, Black Micarta, in this kind of steel. Had it since early '08, it held its edge for a good while. I'm currently working on getting it back in shape and having quite a time of it.

Granted, I'm fairly new to honing razors, but I am enjoying good results with my various knives and the other razor I own - a "Carpe Diem", carbon steel blade. The carbon blade does seem far easier to hone than the stainless...

Originally Posted by gugi

That process benefits stainless steels only. I do have a favourite one, though it's vintage and unfortunately they don't seem to have made them in a 6/8 version.

So is it reasonable to assume that any razor marked 'Cryo-, Ice Tempered, Subcero' etc...are stainless?

The DD Wonderedge is cryo treated and is carbon steel.

Supposedly it makes it harder but from the ones I have either stainless or not I don't see any performance differences.

I'm sure one of our metal experts will chime in with an explanation of the benefits if any of the process.

Originally Posted by thebigspendur

The DD Wonderedge is cryo treated and is carbon steel.

Supposedly it makes it harder but from the ones I have either stainless or not I don't see any performance differences.

I'm sure one of our metal experts will chime in with an explanation of the benefits if any of the process.

tbs,

OK, the guy with the bony fingers wrapped around his throat, what did he do to deserve that fate? Thaw one of your frozen razors in a non-approved cryogenic fashion?

Cryo treatment of steel. It has taken on almost religious qualities and has it's own share of false prophets. I keep trying to come up with an explanation that is short and sweet but that is not easy. But I'll try again.

The reason is to convert retained austenite to martensite. Martensite is the hard form of steel that makes it the good stuff we all want. This crystal is more abrasion resistant, it's harder and tougher and holds the edge longer making that the desirable form of steel for razor edges. Austenite is harder than soft steel but much more brittle and weaker.

Strong carbide formers like chromium, the most common, or other alloying materials influences how much of the carbon can be converted into solution and form austenite when above the critical temperature of the steel and then convert to martensite in the quench.

A steel that has carbon levels below the eutectic point will likely dissolve all the carbon into solution and has little or no retained austenite IF it is heat treated correctly. Hypereutectoid steels will have an excess of carbon available and the likelihood of retained austenite increases because when the martensite forms there is only so much room in the crystalline lattice interstices for the carbon molecule and the excess stuff is trapped as austenite. Alloying elements influence this which is why the steels that gain the most benefit from low temperature quenching are high alloy steels, aka stainless types.

For most carbon steels, correctly heat treated, retained austenite even in say a carbon steel of 0.95% (1095) is inconsequential. There is a risk that any carbon steel that is claimed to improve with cryo treatment has not been heat treated correctly in the first place.

For the record, I'm not for or agin it. I don't do it on my blades. I have argued that the cost does not outweigh any claimed benefit if the basic processes are done right. It does have it's place with the right materials, or because the maker simply has to do it to feel good about themselves or their steel, or as we are all aware of in razors, marketing claims that help make sales. I have more academic criticisms but that makes for a very long answer.

Frankly, as TBS has already intimated, that anyone honing by hand, shaving by hand would have the ability to tell the difference scientifically/objectively. Hmm, now a CATRAL machine setup correctly, maybe, but that's not whiskers. So it would be apples and oranges anyway and we still couldn't be absolutely certain.